It's been a while...
Yes there are 3 kinds of people.
Rushin... you are most likely a nice guy who acted like a bit of a D#CK... you may have some anger issues that will resolve as you age and mellow.
Simon ... you are also a nice dude ... yeah you acted a bit like a PU$$Y ...You don't owe a D#CK anything ... but that's cool ..... you may become less of a PU$$Y as you age and mellow.
The Racist Redneck dudes .... yeah.... you guys are the real AR$EHOLE$.... and that is really the most disappointing part of this whole saga.
Mistakes happen ..... we all do our best in stressful situations to the best of our ability.
Breathe .... Relax ....
Let's move on....
Select to expand quoteAbsolutbeginer said..
Signal to noise ratio on this thread has gone through the roof.
Will the racists clowns please just put a sock in it, there are lessons to be learned here.
As a beginner, If I was Geili and found myself in his lines, regardless of how this came about, I would have ditched my kite and concentrated on getting out of the lines without the pull of my own kite to hinder me.
Does that sound a reasonable thing to do?
Or would releasing my kite just add to the clusterfruck of line in the water?
What would be the best tactic to try and establish how I was tangled and how to resolve it?
How hard would it be to identify the front lines on the kite I was tangled in and pull them in to kill it before it powered up?
Would it be possible to pull myself all the way up to Simon's kite and just ignore all the extra lines around me knowing that as long as the kite is made safe it doesn't matter how many lines are around me, it can be sorted in safety??
In retrospect, it seems that if somebody had of jumped on Simon's kite or deflated it, then all danger would have been diffused and the lines could have been sorted with time and no danger present?
Gilly3, did the thought of deflating either one or both kites ever cross your mind?
You seemed to be quite able to zip around the scene at will in the video, or would you be concerned about getting yourself caught up in a kite if you stopped to try?
Or did you think that Simon's kite would not power up as you took the time to retrieve the board?
I am now paranoid about ever getting caught in another's lines and would do anything to avoid it.
At least if it is my own lines I could follow them and pull them in to kill the kite.
Anybody chime in here with suggestions so I can run them through in my head as a thought experiment so my brain is at least primed to think of them should the situation ever occur.
Don't want to hear about how it got to this situation, that's a different story, just want to hear how I might get out of it should it ever happen to me or what I might be able to do as bystander
How nice would it be to have a small box with a switch on it attached to your harness that when activated released the air from the leading edge?
Yeah your pretty much on it m8 , Its a "every situation is different" thing , so over time ... include here experience ... you can see whos lines are above whos .
And if one kiters lines are slack and in the water , know who needs help first.
As far as getting to your kite . Hold your legs up and touching together ( like as in the top of a breathstroke kick) , grab a center line and go hand over hand down that line just using the hand over hand motion to move you to the kite ,stay hooked in if you can or fire your QR if you must to give your self some time, do not wrap lines around your hands , And if the kite becomes powered let the line slide back out though your hands .. dont fight it.
This is the method you use to self rescue in the surf and is the best way to avoid lines being tangled around you.
Once you get to the kite you can back wrap your lines.
Its a different story if your on a deserted beach with no other kiters around .
However if you introduce a dangerous piece of a equipment into a environment with others in the area , you need to remain responsible and in control of that equipment.
By releasing it you have lost control and the ability to reduce the risk to others in the area and therefore breached a duty of care.
Also you are 100% correct in thinking that definitely had someone jumped on the looping kite , and a chance always presents itself to do so ... sometimes you have to wait for a couple of loops till it settles .... the whole situation would have never of escalated
Select to expand quotescotta said..
It's been a while...
Yes there are 3 kinds of people.
Rushin... you are most likely a nice guy who acted like a bit of a D#CK... you may have some anger issues that will resolve as you age and mellow.
Simon ... you are also a nice dude ... yeah you acted a bit like a PU$$Y ...You don't owe a D#CK anything ... but that's cool ..... you may become less of a PU$$Y as you age and mellow.
The Racist Redneck dudes .... yeah.... you guys are the real AR$EHOLE$.... and that is really the most disappointing part of this whole saga.
Mistakes happen ..... we all do our best in stressful situations to the best of our ability.
Breathe .... Relax ....
Let's move on....
Hey Settle down tiger.
I think that I have read this whole thread. even the parts that have been deleted.
No one has discriminated against any race. The worst thing that was said (along those lines) was 'Take your bad attitude out of AUS'. Or words to that effect. The only race that I can remember reading about was the AUS race.
Oh yeah, and white guys that go out in the sun with out a collar get their necks sunburnt. No need to mock them for it. 
So a death leash is suicide but releasing it is murder? Kiteboarding is so extreme
Select to expand quoteantlanglands said..Absolutbeginer said..
Signal to noise ratio on this thread has gone through the roof.
Will the racists clowns please just put a sock in it, there are lessons to be learned here.
As a beginner, If I was Geili and found myself in his lines, regardless of how this came about, I would have ditched my kite and concentrated on getting out of the lines without the pull of my own kite to hinder me.
Does that sound a reasonable thing to do?
Or would releasing my kite just add to the clusterfruck of line in the water?
What would be the best tactic to try and establish how I was tangled and how to resolve it?
How hard would it be to identify the front lines on the kite I was tangled in and pull them in to kill it before it powered up?
Would it be possible to pull myself all the way up to Simon's kite and just ignore all the extra lines around me knowing that as long as the kite is made safe it doesn't matter how many lines are around me, it can be sorted in safety??
In retrospect, it seems that if somebody had of jumped on Simon's kite or deflated it, then all danger would have been diffused and the lines could have been sorted with time and no danger present?
Gilly3, did the thought of deflating either one or both kites ever cross your mind?
You seemed to be quite able to zip around the scene at will in the video, or would you be concerned about getting yourself caught up in a kite if you stopped to try?
Or did you think that Simon's kite would not power up as you took the time to retrieve the board?
I am now paranoid about ever getting caught in another's lines and would do anything to avoid it.
At least if it is my own lines I could follow them and pull them in to kill the kite.
Anybody chime in here with suggestions so I can run them through in my head as a thought experiment so my brain is at least primed to think of them should the situation ever occur.
Don't want to hear about how it got to this situation, that's a different story, just want to hear how I might get out of it should it ever happen to me or what I might be able to do as bystander
How nice would it be to have a small box with a switch on it attached to your harness that when activated released the air from the leading edge?
Yeah your pretty much on it m8 , Its a "every situation is different" thing , so over time ... include here experience ... you can see whos lines are above whos .
And if one kiters lines are slack and in the water , know who needs help first.
As far as getting to your kite . Hold your legs up and touching together ( like as in the top of a breathstroke kick) , grab a center line and go hand over hand down that line just using the hand over hand motion to move you to the kite ,stay hooked in if you can or fire your QR if you must to give your self some time, do not wrap lines around your hands , And if the kite becomes powered let the line slide back out though your hands .. dont fight it.
This is the method you use to self rescue in the surf and is the best way to avoid lines being tangled around you.
Once you get to the kite you can back wrap your lines.
Its a different story if your on a deserted beach with no other kiters around .
However if you introduce a dangerous piece of a equipment into a environment with others in the area , you need to remain responsible and in control of that equipment.
By releasing it you have lost control and the ability to reduce the risk to others in the area and therefore breached a duty of care.
Also you are 100% correct in thinking that definitely had someone jumped on the looping kite , and a chance always presents itself to do so ... sometimes you have to wait for a couple of loops till it settles .... the whole situation would have never of escalated
Ok, finally some constructive positive discussion here.....hopefully it can continue
Firstly, I am not an instructor nor do I profess to be an expert...just a competent kiter enjoying the stoke I get from this awesome sport!
I am fairly pro active at my local with trying to keep newbies safe by offering advice, retrieving the odd board (but only if they have no chance of getting back to it, as we all know body dragging is a fundamental skill to master) and generally helping out where I can, just paying it back after receiving the same when I first started.
I also do not want to see our local spots closed down from too many unfortunate incidents.
Ant, are u suggesting that someone with a kite attached to them, jump on a looping kite?
My thoughts were to body drag her in closer to shore as the kite would have reached the beach before us, i had noticed at least a half dozen kiters running down the beach who would have more than likely grabbed the kite. I also had to contend with another beginner kiter, between us and the beach, thinking that he could help.
As I said, I had assessed the downwind area and found it to be clear. This formed part of my decision to urge them to release.
Does anyone think that Geili should have stayed attached to her kite whilst being tangled in someone elses lines?
I also believed that removing Simon and her board from the equation (clearing the area) would not only make it safer for myself, but easier to try and rescue only one person. You can probably see in the video that they were only approx. 50-60m from shore.
Absolut, there is no way I was going to try and deflate a kite without ending up in the sh!t myself, nice idea at the end of ur post though.....maybe a small dart 
Terminal, u suggest I may have made a mistake....yet u don't offer any alternative solutions?
Pleeeeeeeeease, constructive discussion only!
Kozzie what is your view on how that case in the uk Supreme Court on joint enterprise in planned murder applies to this kite surfing accident ?
Hey Gilly , yeah man you can deffo grap a deathloop kite while still attached to your own kit.
I've done it b4 afew times ... its like any time you help someone in trouble you have to access the situation and your ability to be able to help without making to whole thing worse.
So I'am not saying just run in all guns blazing.
And sometimes the deathlooping kite will simply be going too fast down wind for you to catch up , then all you can do is follow and hope
You have to sit back to the side abit and watch , at some stage every deathlooping kite will hit the deck and sit there , thats the time to strike.
Best approach in deep water usually would be come in with your kite LOW and slightly downwind (this way even if the kite powers up and start looping again your lines will be under it and you will end up being able to grab it or one of its lines ), also riding in toe side so you can see exactly whats going on.
As you grab the kite let go of your bar and let you kite sit in the water at the edge of the window depowered.
This way if it all goes west and the kite begins to loop again you are clear to drag out of the way.
Again I'm not saying this is for everyone , for some people they would not feel confident enough to attempt this. But our sport is old enough now that I would think there is usually someone around who has had enough experience with deathlooping kites to have a feel for it.
A great read this thread. Human nature at it's finest.
From what I can tell two learners without enough experience to know what to do in a certain situation have an accidental tangle, followed by incident.
Russian dude (boyfriend of learner), with threats of violence, intimidates some local lad learner into buying his learner missus some new gear. A few blokes get a bit riled up over it (the intimidation bit) and fire back in similar manner.
Russian dude fires back with some irrational stuff and an edited video to try make it seem local lad is completely at fault. This riles up the blokes some more. They fire back again.
PC/advocate brigade cry and call blokes Nazis, rednecks and racists (I'm pretty sure we are same race) for firing shots in return over the bow. Aboriginals even get a mention. And if your not one, you are not really an Australian.
I learned Qld's and WA's definition of crowded or busy spot are completely opposite.
I also learned there's a spot on the goldy named after a fried chicken chain.
A nice broad range of personalities there. Without all, this forum would be rather boring. Thanks for the entertainment. Great start to the weekend over a coffee.
Should be fun down at Shearwater from now on. Looks like loads of space. You should see Perth atm, it's chaos! Would be a zillion people out there. If I was in the goldy I'd come down for a kite for sure.
I've been caught up another kiter (beginer) where our lines crossed, tangled, entwined and both kites powered up, in the shore break very close to land and obstacles. Also travelling in opposite directions on full plane. No bodies fault just an accident (can describe circumstances if required to stop trollers hating).
His lines cut across my upper arm causing a nice cut/rope burn but keeping a rational, calm and cool head, while kites franticly looping repetitively and drifting closer to land, we both assessed the situation, agreed to both pull the safety and flag out our kites.
Both kites flagged (never enough friction on lines to stop this from occurring even when a tangeled mess when both flag lines and kept relatively taught) drifted into a safe area and shallow enough to stand and then discussed the process to make it to the kites to flip them into a safe position. One stayed stationary the other traced the flag out line to one kite then the other.
We both worked together to solve the problem, untangled lines, mutually apologised, had a sigh and a laugh and then launched and kept kiteboarding.
Rational minds, collectively communicating and working together to solve a problem reduces risk and associated injuries so DON'T loose your head
KEEP CALM
DON'T GET
BLOWN AWAY
&
RIDE ANOTHER
DAY
I agree this thread shows human nature at its best, not. And when there is too many egos trying hard to know it all better than others, the debate heats up. And sadly, in our country, latest then the high level of xenophobia shows its embarassing side. Really a shame. Guys if you can't solve such trivial situation by using common sense and your brain, leaving all the other horse ****e aside, then I wonder what happens in a more serious situation where someone really gets hurt, in kiting, or in a car, bar, anywhere really. Let's get a little more civilised shall we?
Select to expand quoteGilly3 said..
Ok, finally some constructive positive discussion here.....hopefully it can continue
Firstly, I am not an instructor nor do I profess to be an expert...just a competent kiter enjoying the stoke I get from this awesome sport!
I am fairly pro active at my local with trying to keep newbies safe by offering advice, retrieving the odd board (but only if they have no chance of getting back to it, as we all know body dragging is a fundamental skill to master) and generally helping out where I can, just paying it back after receiving the same when I first started.
I also do not want to see our local spots closed down from too many unfortunate incidents.
Ant, are u suggesting that someone with a kite attached to them, jump on a looping kite?
My thoughts were to body drag her in closer to shore as the kite would have reached the beach before us, i had noticed at least a half dozen kiters running down the beach who would have more than likely grabbed the kite. I also had to contend with another beginner kiter, between us and the beach, thinking that he could help.
As I said, I had assessed the downwind area and found it to be clear. This formed part of my decision to urge them to release.
Does anyone think that Geili should have stayed attached to her kite whilst being tangled in someone elses lines?
I also believed that removing Simon and her board from the equation (clearing the area) would not only make it safer for myself, but easier to try and rescue only one person. You can probably see in the video that they were only approx. 50-60m from shore.
Absolut, there is no way I was going to try and deflate a kite without ending up in the sh!t myself, nice idea at the end of ur post though.....maybe a small dart
Terminal, u suggest I may have made a mistake....yet u don't offer any alternative solutions?
Pleeeeeeeeease, constructive discussion only!
My suggestion was based on - if I was tangled in the lines of someone's partially flagged kite, I would prefer that (based on my ideas of probabilities) to being tangled in the fully released kite's lines. That is the only alternative I would suggest
With hindsight, Simon's kite started power looping shortly after being fully released, but it is possible things would have turned out worse if Simon hadn't fully released. No-one can know for sure.
It was a complicated situation and even the people there couldn't get a clear view of the complete situation as the lines were under water.
I think you did the right thing in reacting fast and helping and the result was, everyone was OK.
I only made my comment because it seemed to me that there might be something to be learned from looking back at the reports of what happened.
Select to expand quoteRushInAir said..
First of all I really appreciate for everyone who help us out and support her on that day!!
Honestly I totally agree with everyone who commented. If I hear the story from him and half of it. I would blame her as well.
Well Well!! It didnt suprise me that you blame her after all. But I dont blame u bcuz If I had personality just like you had, I'd blame her too and if u were honest man u would write down the whole story :)
There is video all welcome to watch it. I am open to any comment, no matter positive or negative. We all learn by our mistake.
Yes I'm her boyfriend and I could sound like bully and a wanker on last Sundy but I could ve been someone more dangerous IF something happened to her. Thankfully she was ok. I hold myself really hard I was quite calm thx to my mates and I knew it was accident. I am sorry and appologies to your FAMILY (NOT YOU) if I show any disrespectful action or over react.
That accident wouldn't happened if Simon had proper kitesurfing lessons and basic knowledge of area. He has been there few times so I suppose he should ve known where to kite and stop or simple ask locals where he had to go and practice and etc.
Simon was continually kiting through the middle of what is respected as the launch/land area instead of being towards the southern end where all the other learners are that keep them sort of out of the way of the general kite and windsurfer traffic.
Geili has only been kiting for 3 months more or less and is still in the early phase of being able to ride in both directions, by no means competantly and still experiences many crashes herself. She is just between begginer and intermediate line.
Simon was on the upwind side of another kiter Geili who was kiting through slightly downwind and behind the learner kiter who suddenly lost control of his kite and dropped the kite immediately in her path where there was zero time for her to do anything but to try and stop and avoid running into or going over the top of his lines at speed.
Unfortunately there was no time to turn around as it all happened in an instant which then caused her to crash her kite as she run into his lines and then the kites became entangled in each other.
Her lines snapped b4 death loop started bcuz Andrey (Guy with core kite) got tangle with her kite while he was trying to save her. Thx Andrey!! Unfortunately I couldnt meet him personally but if u read this pls concact us for up coming event to thank you and everyone else.
There is my suggestion to him;
If you are still learning, in future try to avoid learning right through the middle of the main traffic section of kiters and windsurfers where it is not them that should try to avoid you just because your a learner. It is you who should avoid them.
As Kiters and Windsurfers are out there enjoying themselves, they are not necessarily focussed on you being a learner or identifyimg as such which might be something in your mind. Once again it is not up to them to avoid you but for you to avoid them.
If its busy then perhaps you should find another location where it is more user friendly for you to gain your experience. This is not all the other Kiters problem or responsibility but yours.
If your still stuggling away with things, then perhaps you should seek out a GOOD Instructor to help you out with things and your kite control.
And next time if you got into situation like this, be man go and ask the person you have hurt! "I am sorry for the accident but **** happens" I am glad that you look ok but do you have any other injuries? Is there anything you can help with? "
Bcuz she having trouble breathing when she lays down. Her rips got squeezed while she was mega looping with your kite.
You dont have to say thank for bring your kite one peace with damage, instead of leaving there. Say thx Kyle for that who hold me hard to not pull your kite a part.
You have nice wife bcuz she s done what you had to do.
You must be thankful instead writing this **** down.
I appreciate all comments no matter good or bad. Everyone has own opinion and we appreciate it.
Regardless of what happened and how, you're still an a**hole and bully for acting in a threatening way. People like you are what's becoming wrong with the sport.
Ok... my turn? Yeah?
Ok... sorry I don't mean to troll.
I just want to say one thing ....
I AM NOT RUSHINAIR
That guy is a totally different level of scary.
and Geili you need to get a new boyfriend.
Oh.
That's already been said?
Ok. Cool!
Carry on.
:)
Absolut, there is no way I was going to try and deflate a kite without ending up in the sh!t myself, nice idea at the end of ur post though.....maybe a small dart
That's actually not that hard to do.
No dart required, just electronics.
It could also be an automatic deflate if the safety leash is deployed, like a treadmill safety.
Could probably include a high pressure blow off to prevent kite damage in a crash and an auto blow off at correct pumped up pressure.
A dart gun could be cool though, chase down kite and shoot it.
Essential part of any beginner training.
Select to expand quotehiltonhood said..
So a death leash is suicide but releasing it is murder? Kiteboarding is so extreme
You win 
Rushinair gave up windsurfing to kite after an argument with West Sussex windsurfers 
A great (hopefully) end to a thread which got out of control thanks to not using common sense in the first place, and then scarily illustrating the fact that social skills among kiters are underdeveloped which makes me wonder how really serious situations will be dealt with. Luckily there are a lot of positive examples around everywhere in the country and probably daily, they just don't make it onto sb usually. So there may be hope. While gear costs a fortune perhaps we should enjoy a little more the fact that wind is free of charge and most of us are healthy enough to enjoy this sport and nature. In the end we are doing this for fun aren't we?
Select to expand quotescotta said...
It's been a while...
Yes there are 3 kinds of people.
Rushin... you are most likely a nice guy who acted like a bit of a D#CK... you may have some anger issues that will resolve as you age and mellow.
Simon ... you are also a nice dude ... yeah you acted a bit like a PU$$Y ...You don't owe a D#CK anything ... but that's cool ..... you may become less of a PU$$Y as you age and mellow.
The Racist Redneck dudes .... yeah.... you guys are the real AR$EHOLE$.... and that is really the most disappointing part of this whole saga.
Mistakes happen ..... we all do our best in stressful situations to the best of our ability.
Breathe .... Relax ....
Let's move on....
Don't worry I understood you team America reference and up voted accordingly LOL but you should have done the last paragraph where..
SOMTIMES d#cks f¥€k ar$$holes and pu$$ys get sh#t on them ect. Lol
i got to the 4th page in google of copy pasteing links of entangled kitesurfer drowns before i just felt to sad to carry on
maaaan theres alot of people who died just because they didnt just pull in one of there centers lines somehow. (having someone elses kite wrapped around yours makes this not possible)
what a ****ty ****ing way to go.
Select to expand quoteKozzie said..
i got to the 4th page in google of copy pasteing links of entangled kitesurfer drowns before i just felt to sad to carry on
maaaan theres alot of people who died just because they didnt just pull in one of there centers lines somehow. (having someone elses kite wrapped around yours makes this not possible)
what a ****ty ****ing way to go.
Psst... hook knife. I can put flashing lights on it, if it'll help.
kozzie please stop embarassing yourself, see that safety lanyard , pull the plastic end and hey presto no drowning
Select to expand quoteantlanglands said..
The fact that noone kited over and jumped on 1 of the kites doesnt speak well for the peeps there on the day.
Yeah, kiting over to the accident and jumping on one of the kites would have helped.. lol That is the most retarded thing i've read in a while..
After reading all of this that last post by Kozzie made it all worth it.
GOLD absolute GOLD
as for the rest of the thread bloody hell.
Holy Dooly, i just looked at that video of the incident and a kite Hindenberged out of the sky as a newby unaware of anything in the spacial universe just like ran like full noise into the lines of a death star in slo mo falling like a shotgunned duck out of the sky!
...And no-one willing to accept responsibility! Far canal
Select to expand quotedan111984 said..antlanglands said..
The fact that noone kited over and jumped on 1 of the kites doesnt speak well for the peeps there on the day.
Yeah, kiting over to the accident and jumping on one of the kites would have helped.. lol That is the most retarded thing i've read in a while..
Ok Dan , so explain to me how this is retarded. And how it wouldn't of helped.
And how out of all the crap in this thread you pick the above as the "Most retarded thing you've read"
I tell you what , anytime you want to bring a kite ,ill be glad to hook your steering line under your chicken loop watch you fly off downwind then go jump on your kite and see how retarded you think it is then.
Geez.
I tell you what , I can vouch from personal experience. Retarded is the last thing your going to be calling a guy/girl who jumps on a kite thats trying to drown you.
