Forums > Wing Foiling General

Armstrong MA foil range - any details yet?

Reply
Created by RJFoil > 9 months ago, 3 Oct 2022
CantSwim
WA, 8 posts
17 Jun 2023 1:52PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
eppo said..

BZRider said..
I'm ready for some faster and thinner HA v2 foils. The mast / fuse diameter will have to be reduced at some point to be competitive with sleeker kits but a thinner foil would help close the gap.



for what purpose? obviously code foils didn't get your memo ...


Lol have you riden the code yet Eppo? I wouldn't rag on them too much. You'll be riding them soon enough. Tbh the 850 is the foil you've been waiting for. Get amoungst it

eppo
WA, 9688 posts
17 Jun 2023 1:57PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
CantSwim said..

eppo said..


BZRider said..
I'm ready for some faster and thinner HA v2 foils. The mast / fuse diameter will have to be reduced at some point to be competitive with sleeker kits but a thinner foil would help close the gap.




for what purpose? obviously code foils didn't get your memo ...



Lol have you riden the code yet Eppo? I wouldn't rag on them too much. You'll be riding them soon enough. Tbh the 850 is the foil you've been waiting for. Get amoungst it


no but been in the water with riders i know. looks a great foil. in real time feedback in the water heard - very pitch stable, stable platform with good pump, glide and turn. Works very well with heavier riders to.

i was countering BZ riders need for a sleeker mast / fuse connection if you read it in context.

eppo
WA, 9688 posts
17 Jun 2023 1:59PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
paulweller2 said..

Oahuwaterwalker said..


eppo said..
thanks for sharing above. sick info.




yep... and contributing toward me getting a 140... I think the 205 is going up for sale.



Same. 205 for sale. 180 for all foils now. 140 on order. May consider 70 fuse for speed runs. Can't break 45kmh with 800/180.


yep 180 is where it's at. and prob the 140/220 for varying situations.

MidAtlanticFoil
818 posts
17 Jun 2023 11:44PM
Thumbs Up

Just got off the water with my first 140 session. Wow! I paired it with the 1000, 60 fuse, 795 mast in perfect 4M winds in the Chesapeake bay with some shoulder high bumps, side on. It took a few passes to get the feel for it, but not long. For me it made the 1000 much more enjoyable in those conditions compared to the 205 or 180 tail. Really freed it up nicely and made it less taxing on my legs, allowing cranking turns with less locked in G sensations. Also easier to drop in on juicier swell at full speed, where I previously would have preferred the 800. One of those sessions where I was not thinking I would want to change a thing.

I can't overstate how sick the combo is in regards to breaching. I was tacking heelside out into these huge ramps, launching airs coming down basically back on foil. If I wasn't doing airs I learned how to do these backside / hack / tail slides down the backs of the waves. Also Breaching down waves looking over shoulder at friends riding and no drama.


Can't wait to try it with other front wings.

BZRider
16 posts
18 Jun 2023 5:38AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
eppo said..

BZRider said..
I'm ready for some faster and thinner HA v2 foils. The mast / fuse diameter will have to be reduced at some point to be competitive with sleeker kits but a thinner foil would help close the gap.



for what purpose? obviously code foils didn't get your memo ...


I want a HA v2 to keep up with big ground swell on winter Maliko runs. The Ha725 does just fine in long period wind swell but can't hang onto a bigger ground bomb coming in from depth at 22+ mph. The HA525 doesn't have the glide for my weight. Skilled riders on thinner foil kits can just hook up and luff the wing on these. The F1 Eagle 690 with the 14mm mast and ML 600 are a bit thinner than my Armie kit.
Have never seen a Code foil.

eppo
WA, 9688 posts
18 Jun 2023 12:00PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
BZRider said..

eppo said..


BZRider said..
I'm ready for some faster and thinner HA v2 foils. The mast / fuse diameter will have to be reduced at some point to be competitive with sleeker kits but a thinner foil would help close the gap.




for what purpose? obviously code foils didn't get your memo ...



I want a HA v2 to keep up with big ground swell on winter Maliko runs. The Ha725 does just fine in long period wind swell but can't hang onto a bigger ground bomb coming in from depth at 22+ mph. The HA525 doesn't have the glide for my weight. Skilled riders on thinner foil kits can just hook up and luff the wing on these. The F1 Eagle 690 with the 14mm mast and ML 600 are a bit thinner than my Armie kit.
Have never seen a Code foil.

massive fuse mast connection size wise.

ArthurAlston
NSW, 245 posts
19 Jun 2023 7:56AM
Thumbs Up

It looks like Oskar is testing the pump foil.
www.instagram.com/reel/Ctn7k89tcOi/?igshid=MmJiY2I4NDBkZg==

eppo
WA, 9688 posts
19 Jun 2023 8:48PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
ArthurAlston said..
It looks like Oskar is testing the pump foil.
www.instagram.com/reel/Ctn7k89tcOi/?igshid=MmJiY2I4NDBkZg==


man doesn't that guy feel the cold ! b

ninjatuna
244 posts
19 Jun 2023 8:51PM
Thumbs Up

got the new 220

here is an updated comparison pic



here is best i can profile pic 140, 195 , and 220. It was hard to get the angles of the profiles to all show all together, but the 220 is slightly flatter.

AnyBoard
NSW, 377 posts
20 Jun 2023 8:12AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
eppo said..

ArthurAlston said..
It looks like Oskar is testing the pump foil.
www.instagram.com/reel/Ctn7k89tcOi/?igshid=MmJiY2I4NDBkZg==



man doesn't that guy feel the cold ! b


Oskar knows he's not going to get wet and daytime temp here atm is ok in the sun.

ANfoiler
VIC, 13 posts
20 Jun 2023 8:47AM
Thumbs Up

The 195 is quite flat, not much camber etc. and have only recently noticed that is anhedral. Do the other stabs (140 & 220) follow a similar camber profile?Has anybody tried the 205 with the older HA foils? Worth the upgrade?

MidAtlanticFoil
818 posts
20 Jun 2023 7:43AM
Thumbs Up

Jeremy Wilmotte just left Axis to join the Armstrong team! Looks like Armie found the big wave charger he was looking for

www.instagram.com/reel/Ctr-VKpAMHz/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

eppo
WA, 9688 posts
20 Jun 2023 8:32AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
MidAtlanticFoil said..
Jeremy Wilmotte just left Axis to join the Armstrong team! Looks like Armie found the big wave charger he was looking for

www.instagram.com/reel/Ctr-VKpAMHz/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==


big J rips hey.

MidAtlanticFoil
818 posts
20 Jun 2023 9:11AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
eppo said..

MidAtlanticFoil said..
Jeremy Wilmotte just left Axis to join the Armstrong team! Looks like Armie found the big wave charger he was looking for

www.instagram.com/reel/Ctr-VKpAMHz/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==



big J rips hey.


Huge fan.

radair
151 posts
23 Jun 2023 4:29PM
Thumbs Up

Have you guys noticed the meme creators sh!tting on Armstrong have gone silent since Jez's announcement? ??

eppo
WA, 9688 posts
23 Jun 2023 5:51PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
radair said..
Have you guys noticed the meme creators sh!tting on Armstrong have gone silent since Jez's announcement? ??


give 'em time

ninjatuna
244 posts
24 Jun 2023 4:29AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
ninjatuna said..
I was able to attend the Armie demo here in Florida last weekend. Don't hold me to exact numbers. I wasn't taking notes. This is all memory and digesting what I heard from everyone.

The waves were crap. Mostly knee high if that with an occasional thigh high set in the morning but dying off as the day went on.

There was a motowinch set up on the beach to pull people on prone boards.

There are 2 pump foils coming out. He had the smaller set up with that was probably in the area of 1660 square cm and then there should be another one in the 1880 square cm range.

There were multiple set ups people were riding. There were some really good prone riders there that could pump a long time. There were prone setups with the 1475 and 180 , the 1750 and 180, and then the pump setup which I am calling the 1660 with the pump tail coming out too. I am pretty sure all 60 fuses. I am only sup foiler and wing foiler cuz of shoulder injuries so my prone days have been done before foiling started. I have no pump game but plan I working on it all summer. I was amazed in the small waves how maneuverable the all three of those front wings were. The guys did not have to make long drawn out turns. The turns were tight and able to cut back and switch directions at will. Then Aiden put the 140 tail on either the 1475 or 1750 and let the guys try it. They basically said it was way better than the 180. After riding the 140 none them saw a reason to get the 180.

One thing Armie specified was that changing tails was one of the easiest and cheapest ways to change a foil setup's characteristics. I believe that because I have almost all them. I added the 140 to my quiver to see how it does.

Armie had his custom DW board and him and Aiden were able to flat water pump it up with the pump foil setup in like 5 or 6 strokes. And then continue to pump it around at will for a while riding the small waves we had.

Once all the prone guys got tired later in the morning. I wanted to try the pump foil setup on my 7'7 Armie DW board. The waves had died to just about nothing by this time. Only a small swell bump going over the sandbar and then breaking on the beach. So this was only my second time on my DW board and I am not anything remotely close to being able to pump a foil. I was almost able to get up on one of these micro swells. I will definitely be grabbing one of these when they are available. Aiden also said how much forward projection the 220 has for the downwind and pumping. I am waiting to get that one when it becomes available.

Talking with Armie and Aiden was a definite treat. Both full of energy and stoke and very knowledgeable on how all their stuff works.

Here are some pics of the 140 , 195 , and 205 for comparison for anyone curious.






Here is a video of the day I was talking about. he is riding the 1475, you'll see and his comments

www.instagram.com/p/CtkvxI7Ab84/

wingedsurfer
67 posts
26 Jun 2023 11:53PM
Thumbs Up

Hello all,
anyone already compared back to back the 180 speed and the 140 dart? thanks!
Andrea

eppo
WA, 9688 posts
27 Jun 2023 7:17AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
ninjatuna said..


ninjatuna said..
I was able to attend the Armie demo here in Florida last weekend. Don't hold me to exact numbers. I wasn't taking notes. This is all memory and digesting what I heard from everyone.

The waves were crap. Mostly knee high if that with an occasional thigh high set in the morning but dying off as the day went on.

There was a motowinch set up on the beach to pull people on prone boards.

There are 2 pump foils coming out. He had the smaller set up with that was probably in the area of 1660 square cm and then there should be another one in the 1880 square cm range.

There were multiple set ups people were riding. There were some really good prone riders there that could pump a long time. There were prone setups with the 1475 and 180 , the 1750 and 180, and then the pump setup which I am calling the 1660 with the pump tail coming out too. I am pretty sure all 60 fuses. I am only sup foiler and wing foiler cuz of shoulder injuries so my prone days have been done before foiling started. I have no pump game but plan I working on it all summer. I was amazed in the small waves how maneuverable the all three of those front wings were. The guys did not have to make long drawn out turns. The turns were tight and able to cut back and switch directions at will. Then Aiden put the 140 tail on either the 1475 or 1750 and let the guys try it. They basically said it was way better than the 180. After riding the 140 none them saw a reason to get the 180.

One thing Armie specified was that changing tails was one of the easiest and cheapest ways to change a foil setup's characteristics. I believe that because I have almost all them. I added the 140 to my quiver to see how it does.

Armie had his custom DW board and him and Aiden were able to flat water pump it up with the pump foil setup in like 5 or 6 strokes. And then continue to pump it around at will for a while riding the small waves we had.

Once all the prone guys got tired later in the morning. I wanted to try the pump foil setup on my 7'7 Armie DW board. The waves had died to just about nothing by this time. Only a small swell bump going over the sandbar and then breaking on the beach. So this was only my second time on my DW board and I am not anything remotely close to being able to pump a foil. I was almost able to get up on one of these micro swells. I will definitely be grabbing one of these when they are available. Aiden also said how much forward projection the 220 has for the downwind and pumping. I am waiting to get that one when it becomes available.

Talking with Armie and Aiden was a definite treat. Both full of energy and stoke and very knowledgeable on how all their stuff works.

Here are some pics of the 140 , 195 , and 205 for comparison for anyone curious.








Here is a video of the day I was talking about. he is riding the 1475, you'll see and his comments

www.instagram.com/p/CtkvxI7Ab84/



so is that aiden on the 1475 . it's not armie? ?

Looks an easy pumper .

eppo
WA, 9688 posts
27 Jun 2023 7:22AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
wingedsurfer said..
Hello all,
anyone already compared back to back the 180 speed and the 140 dart? thanks!
Andrea


i know Oskar has ridden both extensively. maybe ask
him on the armie rider facebook page. he's the one to ask. i've read the what you'd expect . 140 faster, turns sharper - better in the wave pocket. But doesn't pump and easily - so better for lighter riders and or if towing, kiting and maybe winging if you are a shredder.

ninjatuna
244 posts
27 Jun 2023 8:01AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
eppo said..





so is that aiden on the 1475 . it's not armie? ?

Looks an easy pumper .


No, that is not Aiden, that is local ripper named Laitham

MidAtlanticFoil
818 posts
27 Jun 2023 10:33AM
Thumbs Up

140 Dart / 1750MA / 50 Fuse pairing notes: Wing - (Upwind Dwing session in small river swell - notes on conditions at end)

The small tail paired with the big foil wing and short fuse made for the most dynamic big foil session I've had to date. I broke the golden rule and made two bigger changes at once...first time 50 fuse w/ 1750 and first time 140 w/ 1750, which resulted in my best DW feels in minimal 'bay' conditions to date. Despite a very 'slow' maximum speed, the ride felt very nimble and efficient.

First off on 50CM fuse: The shortened arc of the pump and the resulting freeing up of the pump motion really made it easy for me, a lightweight at 65KGs, to be able to place the large foil where I wanted in a hurry without expending a lot of energy. Small rear leg calf pumps resulted in 6" or more height changes (with narrow stance). Coming in at the end of the session, I fully buried the nose by mistake and was able to recover to continue pumping and finding bumps, while holding my wing. I don't think I could have pulled that with the 60 fuse.

Notes on Fuse Length versus Weight: Imagine my 65kg frame's COG moving forward 2 inches versus an 85kg frame moving forward 2 inches, the 85kg easily creates a much larger lever effect on the foil. As a smaller rider, the amount of body movement forward and back (or muscle output) must be much greater than a larger rider all things constant. The shorter fuse really makes things easier effort wise for my weight, so long as balance and quick reactions can play the part. I imagine the 50 fuse would result in an even more dynamic (and challenging) ride for a larger rider. Being a smaller rider, I have the ability to move my COG over a larger 'sweet spot' area all things constant when compared to a larger rider. The shorter 50cm fuse probably gives me a similar ride 'sweet spot' compared to what larger riders experiences on a 60CM or even 70CM fuse.

The 140 Dart lives up to its name an really allows for quick heal/tow initiated turns, despite the huge span of the 1750 - resulting in a darting feeling for the whole rig. The lack of drag also really opens up the glide of the 1750 and allows for easier/less fatiguing pumping at my weight. I was easily performing my best DW wing riding in almost negative wind at times due to the setup. When riding small bumps, swinging the foil to the top of the bump and resetting efficiently on the appropriate angle is the name of the game. This combo excelled there. I was easily able to glide out a series of bumps and then pump off to find more, without really being out of breath upon finding the next set. I'm not sure how much of this was the 140 or the 50 fuse, but it was a breakthrough for me while carrying a wing. I desperately wanted to keep going, but I was setting myself up for a problem heading downwind in such light conditions on the other side of a fishing pier with no public exit DW. Stall speed seemed amazingly low considering the small tail, but that may be also due to the more forward positioning of the mast?

Winging while Tacking upwind felt great, despite the basically 8knts of wind or less most stretches. A quick toeside tack followed by two foil and wing pumps in unison would reset in the other direction - sort of perfect considering gybes were backwinding and required Heineken gybes to work properly. By setting a steady, tight, upwind arc, this allowed the speed to be carried into the new tack and not waisted into the breeze, despite starting the new tack with barely any apparent wind. Small margin for error!

If I had time and not been dealing with a packed fishing pier DW wedging my side-onshore launch, I would have tested the 180 and 220 tails in comparison.



Condition Notes: Super light wind river session with knee high bumps (leftovers from earlier wind) and 6'3" DW board and 4Nitro, then 5M OR Glide. Winds occasionally gusting to 15knts, but 80% of time around 8-10knts or less. First mast set at 7or8 and could barely control it. Changed up to 9.5 and it came alive.

dejavu
825 posts
27 Jun 2023 11:20AM
Thumbs Up

radair
151 posts
27 Jun 2023 8:38PM
Thumbs Up

Good stuff Graham! I took my 7' x 100 L Dagger out behind my boat last week and paired it with the 1750, 50 fuse and V200 tail on a 60 cm mast. Wake foiling on this setup was a lot different than the usual small board & small foil! But I found similar results with great response for the reasons you note. The glide is so good that I was able to cross to the opposite side wake with no pumping multiple times and treat the second wake like a wind bump carving back and forth behind the trough. At the end of the run I flatwater pumped a LONG way, even gravedigging back high on the mast when I started slapping down.
Short fuse and small tail make these big span wings really come alive. I used this same setup with the HA1325 quite a bit while winging last winter as well with good results.

Sonsaleta
80 posts
27 Jun 2023 10:59PM
Thumbs Up

After using the 205 , the 180, I received and tried the dart140 (+1 red). Wing.
wind : 8-11 knots max. In this light conditions I use the 1225 (795, 50) - 68L. I really liked it. I want only 1 stab for everything. Until now I was doubting between the 205 and the 180. 205 better for carving and to reconnect after a jump. The 180 less drag. If it feel good with the 1225 I suppose it will be still better with the 800 or the 625 but I have to try it to be sure. At least the stab makes the front wing more playfull. At low speed it affects a bit the pitch stability (especially with the 50 fuse) but that's fine. I feel clearly less drag with the dart. I will keep it for all the conditions.

Sonsaleta
80 posts
27 Jun 2023 10:59PM
Thumbs Up

After using the 205 , the 180, I received and tried the dart140 (+1 red). Wing.
wind : 8-11 knots max. In this light conditions I use the 1225 (795, 50) - 68L. I really liked it. I want only 1 stab for everything. Until now I was doubting between the 205 and the 180. 205 better for carving and to reconnect after a jump. The 180 less drag. If it feel good with the 1225 I suppose it will be still better with the 800 or the 625 but I have to try it to be sure. At least the stab makes the front wing more playfull. At low speed it affects a bit the pitch stability (especially with the 50 fuse) but that's fine. I feel clearly less drag with the dart. I will keep it for all the conditions.

Sonsaleta
80 posts
29 Jun 2023 4:36AM
Thumbs Up

Today 800 and the dart 140. 13-15 knots.
Foil much looser with this stab. At the start a bit too much but we get used.
Curiously really good pop for the jumps. Maybe just because I go quicker with this tail. Tough for me to see that.
I have the 625 for the big conditions but I think the 800 with the dart will do the job with the possibility to go slower in some sections you need that, for example if there is big traffic :) with others wings, windsurfers, kiters..
Really good combo.

paulweller2
151 posts
29 Jun 2023 5:12AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Sonsaleta said..
Today 800 and the dart 140. 13-15 knots.
Foil much looser with this stab. At the start a bit too much but we get used.
Curiously really good pop for the jumps. Maybe just because I go quicker with this tail. Tough for me to see that.
I have the 625 for the big conditions but I think the 800 with the dart will do the job with the possibility to go slower in some sections you need that, for example if there is big traffic :) with others wings, windsurfers, kiters..
Really good combo.



What's your weight? Been using the 180 for everything now. Keen to get the 140. The 800/180 is incredible--can only imagine how much better the 800 is with the 140.

Sonsaleta
80 posts
29 Jun 2023 10:59AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
paulweller2 said..

Sonsaleta said..
Today 800 and the dart 140. 13-15 knots.
Foil much looser with this stab. At the start a bit too much but we get used.
Curiously really good pop for the jumps. Maybe just because I go quicker with this tail. Tough for me to see that.
I have the 625 for the big conditions but I think the 800 with the dart will do the job with the possibility to go slower in some sections you need that, for example if there is big traffic :) with others wings, windsurfers, kiters..
Really good combo.




What's your weight? Been using the 180 for everything now. Keen to get the 140. The 800/180 is incredible--can only imagine how much better the 800 is with the 140.


75 kg

Sonsaleta
80 posts
5 Aug 2023 9:13PM
Thumbs Up

After many sessions in different conditions I arrive to the conclusion that :
the Dart 140 fit really well with MA625 and MA800. up of 800 the speed is not enough high and the 180 fit better. (Both with red shim)



Subscribe
Reply

Forums > Wing Foiling General


"Armstrong MA foil range - any details yet?" started by RJFoil