I sailed Pookipa on Sunday morning after the triathlon - yes, through the "swimmers only" zone because in a SW there's really no other way of getting off the beach...
AND PULLED A DEAD POSSUM OUT OF THE SHORE BREAK OF THIS "SWIMMERS ONLY" ZONE
Next time I'll take a photo to use in the campaign.
The thing about Pookipa is they've extended the "swimming only" zone south so that it now includes the stormwater drain ("poo-pipe"). This is one point we'll need to push as this decision they've made likely increases risks to public safety. They should have done a risk assessment about this, as it seems absurd having a major urban stormwater outlet in a swimming zone. Not only that, it's rocky and treacherous when the waves are up. It also creates a blind spot for the lifesavers on the south side of the drain.
It will probably be hard to get them to move the pole back (we can try though), but a possible more likely option is to request they put the yellow buoy (which sat where the pole now is) back to where the old pole was, and allow windsurfers to go south of it. This would be a balanced outcome and cater for swimmers, windsurfers and reduced the stormwater risk to swimmers, which they've clearly enhanced.
Select to expand quotefrenijffels said..
It got serious yesterday at Dendy St with 2 of us getting a formal warning and one guy - prob had them waiting too long by staying out - getting a fine of a gentle $279 dollares!!!
The water police got called in again (they were at Dendy last Sun too) from the life saving club and recorded all us offenders on camera :-) ....
They told me there had been a incident last week where a swimmer was overrun by a sailor???? And 3 marks on the back (must be a thruster sailor lol)
Anyway, I feel for the fined guy...wet blanket on a nice afternoon's session
Be alerted!!!
Aloha
Gingerpom has worked on a way to avoid this happening. He has been practising the walk of shame for many years- it means you never come back to the place you left from and thus cant pick up a ticket when you hit the beach where the "water police are waiting. Cleaver POM.
Has anyone written/emailed to the relevant state MPs, or even their local MP, about this? I work in fed gov and we get the flow on from public letters/emails to fed MPs every second week and it certainly highlights concerns...
I contacted Murray Thompson (Sandringham MP) once about another issue [bayside councils insane decision to scrap my kids childcare] and he was back to me quickly - and not just via email but actually rang and chatted to me for some time. I know he has done the same with another person. Ok, my kids childcare still seems screwed, but... he was interested and was genuine about understanding and seeing where he could inject himself.
I'd suggest popping an email to the MPs around the bay, and through them ask questions of PV.
Murray Thompson would cover Ricketts - his email is: murray.thompson@parliament.vic.gov.au www.murraythompson.com.au/contact
Louise Asher covers Dendy St to Pookipa - louise.asher@parliament.vic.gov.au www.parliament.vic.gov.au/about/people-in-parliament/members-search
Lorraine Wreford covers Parkdale - lorraine.wreford@parliament.vic.gov.au www.lorrainewreford.com.au/
Search others out using the maps at www.parliament.vic.gov.au/members/electorate/Sandringham
That said, if you do email them dont rant; have a considered point of view and be objective, because they can only action facts not opinions.
For sending letters/emails to local MPs could we have an agreed, consistent set of GPS coordinates plus illustrated map(s) to indicate exactly the locations being petitioned?
It certainly seems that KBV did a good job protecting kite spots with St Kilda, Brighton's Kite beach, Hampton's 'No-Mates' all being designated Wind sport zones - while specific windsurf spots like Dendy St, Rickets & Elwood get locked out?
If we let Authorities bugger us now where will it stop? im sorry but a swimmer deserves a good spray in the face if he thinks he can swim across an area that is the worst spot for them and the best for us i say Revolt against the Authorities all because of a dickhead on a jetski that thought he was doing burnouts in his commodore WTF ?
Select to expand quoteAcker said..
The thing about Pookipa is they've extended the "<span class="k5l293a2" id="k5l293a2_15">swimming</span> only" zone <span class="k5l293a2" id="k5l293a2_12">south</span> so that it now includes the <span class="k5l293a2" id="k5l293a2_5">stormwater drain</span> ("poo-pipe"). This is one point we'll need to push as this decision they've made likely increases risks to public safety. They should have done a <span class="k5l293a2" id="k5l293a2_2">risk assessment</span> about this, as it seems absurd having a major urban stormwater outlet in a swimming zone. Not only that, it's rocky and treacherous when the waves are up. It also creates a blind spot for the lifesavers on the south side of the drain.
It will probably be hard to get them to move the pole back (we can try though), but a possible more likely option is to request they put the yellow buoy (which sat where the pole now is) back to where the old pole was, and allow windsurfers to go south of it. This would be a balanced outcome and cater for swimmers, windsurfers and reduced the stormwater risk to swimmers, which they've clearly enhanced.
Good point mate 
Select to expand quoteAcker said..
The thing about Pookipa is they've extended the "<span class="v95487a0301u" id="v95487a0301u_18">swimming</span> only" zone <span class="v95487a0301u" id="v95487a0301u_15">south</span> so that it now includes the <span class="v95487a0301u" id="v95487a0301u_7">stormwater drain</span> ("poo-pipe"). This is one point we'll need to push as this decision they've made likely increases risks to public safety. They should have done a <span class="v95487a0301u" id="v95487a0301u_2">risk assessment</span> about this, as it seems absurd having a major urban stormwater outlet in a swimming zone. Not only that, it's rocky and treacherous when the waves are up. It also creates a blind spot for the lifesavers on the south side of the drain.
It will probably be hard to get them to move the pole back (we can try though), but a possible more likely option is to request they put the yellow buoy (which sat where the pole now is) back to where the old pole was, and allow windsurfers to go south of it. This would be a balanced outcome and cater for swimmers, windsurfers and reduced the stormwater risk to swimmers, which they've clearly enhanced.
Next time put it on your board and drop it right in there path they might then realize how filthy the water is 
I think it might be useful to engage the swimmers who are your Beach Road cyclist equivalents for swimming at Elwood..... I know a girl who swims with her swimming club there occasionally, and you might see a gaggle of them going around the markers usually in summer.
If you could get them onside, it would further the case for safety. I'm sure, as much as cyclists want to be hit by cars on Beach Road, swimmers don't want to cop a fin across their back, or be paranoid while swimming.
I'm going to ask around.
Roughly to scale demonstration of wind..... obviously tack dependent on gear and skill........ (red zone is 200m out per google map scale - using same angle as the PV map).
I have heard from discussions with a PV manager at work that a number of errors were made in positioning the markers, including one incorrectly put right in the middle of the start line at Sandringham for their regular yacht racing. Apparantly some issues between instructions given and where the pile drivers have actually sunk them. From what I've heard, there is still some readjustment of poles happening based on these errors made.
This may give us a bit of hope to shift them to more respectable positions.
He advised best thing is to make a list of all the locations where we think there are issues with being disadvantaged, safety etc.
Prob need a diagram or map for each one, clearly pointing out or illustrating the main issues (i.e. no waffly 4 page rants).
Can discuss this tomorrow night.
Good stuff Andy, anyone have the GPS locations of the new poles? Better still the old ones as well.
Yup, we have been shafted. Found a Google Earth image showing the locations of the old pole and buoy and they have moved it across about 60m. We really need to push hard to have the poles put in a more manageable location otherwise all will be FINE at Dawson street.
Those life savers are like a dog with a new bone, scored some new territory and they will be hell bent on keeping it.
Having only sailed at Dendy St a couple of times I am not sure how the conditions there have been affected or weather a little pole nudge would make any difference.
We need to be solution focus and constructive if we are going to get any joy from ParksVic so put your thinking caps on.
Are we talking about yellow markers with a yellow cross on top? One has just appeared in Parkdale. What do they signify? Its just on the Mentone side of the yacht club.
They are as Im led to believe a special mark. They are mainly a max speed of 5 kts. However look at parks vic They can be used for swim zones. No boating zones etc. They are more then not un signed and un lit. I only checked this out as I was warned by a Parks vic officer I was in a swim zone. July??
The only reason he did not isue a 400 plus fine was There were no signs at the beach ( sand ridge Port Melb.)
Select to expand quoteSputnik11 said..
Are we talking about yellow markers with a yellow cross on top? One has just appeared in Parkdale. What do they signify? Its just on the Mentone side of the yacht club.
These markers are about 200m from shore and many indicate the 5knots or swimming only zones. Unfortunately the signs are only readable from the water, not from the beach. I sailed in Parkdale quite often until about 4 weeks ago and havent noticed any, but there were a lot of them in Mentone then. Would be interesting to see what signs are on it. I may drive past there tomorrow before the meeting.
The following are some facts that you need to consider when approaching Parks Vic or Council:
1..Stake holder meetings were run back in August 2008, see details below, to discuss the zoning currently being implemented.
2..These meetings where attended by local SLC, yatch clubs, Jets Ski Assoc(?), Motor boat clubs, KBV, SV (I think) and local residents. I attended 2 meetings on behalf of KBV at Safety Beach and Carrum.
3..At these meetings we where invited to mark up maps to indicate "water sports" areas and we included every possible area we could think of. The majority of these area where totally disregarded.
4..We also made suggestion about seasonal zoning which was also disregarded.
5..Parks Vic have duristriction of all waterways starting at the high tide mark not the local council, however I understand that they where going to work in conjunction with the councils of the day.
6..The resulting zoning which was disappointing to say the least, and did not seem to take much of what was said from our perspective into account, was pulished some time later. It has been around now for many years!!
7..The zoning being implemented has now been around for years and would pre-date any of the current councillors and probably most of the Parks Vic people implementing them.
8..The 5 knot rule has been around for ever and is not new.....
The workshop dates were as follows, I think an additional meeting was held at Altona:
"Please find attached your invitation to participate in the Stakeholder Consultation Workshops for the
Boating Zones Review Project.
I won?t send you an individual invitation for all the workshops, but you are invited to attend all. The dates
are as follows, all running at the same time from 6pm to 8pm:
1. Parks Hall Bay View Room, Newcombe St, Portarlington - Thursday 31 July 2008
2. Royal Geelong Yacht Club, Geelong - Tuesday 5 August 2008
3. Coast Guard & Sailing Club Community Centre, Marine Drive, Safety Beach - Tuesday 12 August 2008
4. Patterson River Motor Boat Club, Stephens Street, Carrum - Thursday 14 August 2008
5. Lifesaving Victoria Headquarters, 200 The Boulevard, Port Melbourne - Thursday 21 August 2008
Accompanying this invitation is an agenda for the evening and a copy of the boating zones framework.
The RSVP and further information contact details are all contained in the attached invitation.
Cheers
Hannah"
Gu
ys
,
Select to expand quotejakranz said..Sputnik11 said..
Are we talking about yellow markers with a yellow cross on top? One has just appeared in Parkdale. What do they signify? Its just on the Mentone side of the yacht club.
These markers are about 200m from shore and many indicate the 5knots or swimming only zones. Unfortunately the signs are only readable from the water, not from the beach. I sailed in Parkdale quite often until about 4 weeks ago and havent noticed any, but there were a lot of them in Mentone then. Would be interesting to see what signs are on it. I may drive past there tomorrow before the meeting.
Hope the meeting went well tonight, but I have a horrible suspicion its a waste of time. Sounds like the horse has well and truly bolted on this one. Kitesurfers had their voice heard (or not depending on who you listen to) but windsurfers seem to have been completely ignored. If 'consultation' happened in 2008, we're screwed guys. The pro forma shown here by Smithy is frankly, absolute gobshyte. If that's what constitutes consultation, we never had a chance. Just have to hope no-one catches me and fines me. Maybe we can work out a system for warning each other if the fuzz are trying to enforce stupid and unfair zones.
Select to expand quoteSputnik11 said..jakranz said..Sputnik11 said..
Are we talking about yellow markers with a yellow cross on top? One has just appeared in Parkdale. What do they signify? Its just on the Mentone side of the yacht club.
These markers are about 200m from shore and many indicate the 5knots or swimming only zones. Unfortunately the signs are only readable from the water, not from the beach. I sailed in Parkdale quite often until about 4 weeks ago and havent noticed any, but there were a lot of them in Mentone then. Would be interesting to see what signs are on it. I may drive past there tomorrow before the meeting.
Hope the meeting went well tonight, but I have a horrible suspicion its a waste of time. Sounds like the horse has well and truly bolted on this one. Kitesurfers had their voice heard (or not depending on who you listen to) but windsurfers seem to have been completely ignored. If 'consultation' happened in 2008, we're screwed guys. The pro forma shown here by Smithy is frankly, absolute gobshyte. If that's what constitutes consultation, we never had a chance. Just have to hope no-one catches me and fines me. Maybe we can work out a system for warning each other if the fuzz are trying to enforce stupid and unfair zones.
Sputnik, I had a look this morning at Parkdale (I guess that's the area close to your heart). As far I can see there is no issue sailing there launching from the yacht club. The marker has no signs attached and as such it signifies the usual 5knot rule that's all over the place, unless you're in a shared wind sport zone, which is south of Parker's cafe. The marker that you mentioned is roughly in the spot as shown on the map. There's is no swimming only zone that you can get pinged, it's way further south in Mordi.
IMHO I think the meeting went well, lots of ideas and there were volunteers taking actions to help tackling the problem spots, would have been good to share your opinion there.
Hey guys I just wanted to share this info about the changes that was posted on the Kite boarding forums by Robinb.
Hi everyone. I have rung Parks about this and they tell me that the prime mover on this Swimming Only zone was Bayside Council. You might want to put some pressure on the three local councillors for the area: ffrederico@bayside.vic.gov.au blowe@bayside.vic.gov.au jlong@bayside.vic.gov.au. The Director City Strategy is swickramasinghe@bayside.vic.gov.au
Please write and express your thoughts: one response has been that it must have been an executive decision not involving the councillors: my answer to that, is that Council should then mandate a change of policy to the executive.
PS Parks say that SUP boards are OK under the new rules, but kayaks are forbidden. Blowed if I can work out the logic of that!
Robinb has typed up an e-mail he has sent to them on our forums if you wanna have a look.
www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Kitesurfing/Victoria/No-boating-zones-Hampton/
Great to see 40 windsurfers at the meeting last night - useful discussion.
Well done to the 4 volunteers who put their hands up to fight for the right to sail certain areas of PPB.
I sail Invy and we have had to fight similar battles with Gippsland Ports.
YOU GUYS NEED MORE VOLUNTEERS. This issue is not going to go away. Enforcement will continue and the roll out of new zones will continue.
This will not be an overnight fix - it will be a long battle. You need more hands on deck.
I was surprised by the lack of people willing to fight for the right to sail certain locations
Select to expand quoteOld Salty said..
Great to see 40 windsurfers at the meeting last night - useful discussion.
Well done to the 4 volunteers who put their hands up to fight for the right to sail certain areas of PPB.
I sail Invy and we have had to fight similar battles with Gippsland Ports.
YOU GUYS NEED MORE VOLUNTEERS. This issue is not going to go away. Enforcement will continue and the roll out of new zones will continue.
This will not be an overnight fix - it will be a long battle. You need more hands on deck. I was surprised by the lack of people willing to fight for the right to sail certain locations
The good thing was the guys that did put there hands up are people that are used to dealing with red tape and government departments and have good communication skills. Plus this is the 1st step and no point having to many people going over the same thing with the same departments.
Im sure when we need more hands on deck at a later date to show numbers more will be available.
Select to expand quotejakranz said..Sputnik11 said..jakranz said..Sputnik11 said..
Are we talking about yellow markers with a yellow cross on top? One has just appeared in Parkdale. What do they signify? Its just on the Mentone side of the yacht club.
These markers are about 200m from shore and many indicate the 5knots or swimming only zones. Unfortunately the signs are only readable from the water, not from the beach. I sailed in Parkdale quite often until about 4 weeks ago and havent noticed any, but there were a lot of them in Mentone then. Would be interesting to see what signs are on it. I may drive past there tomorrow before the meeting.
Hope the meeting went well tonight, but I have a horrible suspicion its a waste of time. Sounds like the horse has well and truly bolted on this one. Kitesurfers had their voice heard (or not depending on who you listen to) but windsurfers seem to have been completely ignored. If 'consultation' happened in 2008, we're screwed guys. The pro forma shown here by Smithy is frankly, absolute gobshyte. If that's what constitutes consultation, we never had a chance. Just have to hope no-one catches me and fines me. Maybe we can work out a system for warning each other if the fuzz are trying to enforce stupid and unfair zones.
Sputnik, I had a look this morning at Parkdale (I guess that's the area close to your heart). As far I can see there is no issue sailing there launching from the yacht club. The marker has no signs attached and as such it signifies the usual 5knot rule that's all over the place, unless you're in a shared wind sport zone, which is south of Parker's cafe. The marker that you mentioned is roughly in the spot as shown on the map. There's is no swimming only zone that you can get pinged, it's way further south in Mordi.
IMHO I think the meeting went well, lots of ideas and there were volunteers taking actions to help tackling the problem spots, would have been good to share your opinion there.
Would have been there, but was left with fathering duties at home. By the sound of it there was a good group there and some capable hands. I will put my hand up here and be happy to assist. Jerry's point is a good one though, it might be counter-productive to have too many people doing the same thing without coordination. Would be happy to pick something up though if there is more support needed. PM me.
High risk strategy guys. Lethargy is where the problem started from in the first place. Get behind Steve and register your interest to help out. He can only marshall the troops that he is aware of that want to get involved.
This is will be a long campaign and having only 4 people willing to have a good just sums up your problem.Not enough people willing to put back into the sport.How many turned up to the WV AGM .......1 non committee member Time to front up people and do the hard work or you'll get something even worse.Support your sport and the organisation with something more than just angry words and make something happen this time. Time for the AWA to finish its process and become a recognised sporting organisation and not the mess it is at the moment.ie can't apply for Gov grants , not recognised by the AIS .
Rant over
At Dendy st it's been like this for many years say 20 years. If we upset swimmers or lifesavers they ring one number and we are in trouble.
Maybe we encourage swimmers not to use the boating posts. They are swimming along boating boundaries and we are getting in trouble. If we encourage them to swim between measured swimming bouys a little closer to the beach, say 50 metre triangle or square some problems may go away and make things a little safer. Council spend money on fitness equipment in parks let's all think outside the square and see where we go. What else could we offer lifesavers? They could time themselves between bouys. A sign on the beach explaining how the bouys work and reasons why parks Victoria don't want swimmers at the poles??
All valid points. All raised on Wednesday.
I'm with you Kato on the awa. What are they actually for?
If we have no voice or representation from a broader sporting body, then we're screwed.
Does the awa have any links to anything other than the state bodies ?
Would we be better off just getting under sports Vic? We pay taxes and what doesn't get squandered by the government seems to be given out to sporting bodies....why has windsurfing opted out of this?
Why are we just fifty angry people in a room with no influence....when all we want to do is reduce two swimming areas by around fifty metres each?
It's ridiculous.
I suppose that one of the points I have been trying to make from my previous posts is that this was determined and published in draft and then final format in the public domain a long time ago and supposedly with our consultation.
It is a shame we have only just found our voices to speak up. Any actions now are going to have to consider this and demonstrate why we have waited all this time before acting.
How many of you where sailing back in 2008, where aware of these original workshops, draft plans, members of Seabreeze, SV or KBV???
I am extremely frustrated with this, as are you all, but from the perspective that I was at some of the original Parks Vic meetings but at the time when we needed action there was almost total disinterest from the broader windsurfing and kiteboarding community.
Select to expand quoteginger pom said..
All valid points. All raised on Wednesday.
I'm with you Kato on the awa. What are they actually for?
If we have no voice or representation from a broader sporting body, then we're screwed.
Does the awa have any links to anything other than the state bodies ?
Would we be better off just getting under sports Vic? We pay taxes and what doesn't get squandered by the government seems to be given out to sporting bodies....why has windsurfing opted out of this?
Why are we just fifty angry people in a room with no influence....when all we want to do is reduce two swimming areas by around fifty metres each?
It's ridiculous.
Valid point Ginger. AWA and WV are not affiliated with any other Australian sporting bodies. If you affiliate with Yachting Vic you come under Sports Vic and are a Nationally registered sporting organisation. This has relevance being in a larger more powerful organisation and for access to a greater variety of grants. If we are successful in getting Parks Vic to change their mind the first thing they will say is who is going to pay for moving the poles. Hmmm cannot see the memberships dues being enough to cover for this. Drift will correct me but I think at Invy they quoted in the $10000 of dollars to move a no boating pole.
