The issue I am running into with practicing my foiling gybes is Andy is not there, seriously. When he was watching and coaching me, yelling pump pump pump, and flip flip, I did the foiling gybes at good speed. But on my own I now realize I am entering them too slow most of the time, and that is due to caution because I am foiling alone. So have to suck it up and start entering the gybes with good speed!
That's my finding, too. "Speed is your friend." Always has been, even for fin jibes. Rhonda used to say that a lot.
At least if you fall you land in 75-80F water, rather than the 48F water up here in the Columbia right now this time of year. Don't let go of the boom, especially if you are foiling with a cambered sail.
Select to expand quoteaeroegnr said..Sandman1221 said..
Well when I had my camp with Andy, he wanted me to go away from him going hard upwind, try a gybe, then come back towards him again going hard upwind and then try anther gybe right in front of him. By going hard upwind, away and towards him, I was not wasting time slogging up to him after every run. I think that is easy to understand, right?
Him telling you to add front foot pressure makes me think that you were trying to point too hard upwind and were barely above stalling speed. This is the only thing that makes sense to me. I have to push hard on the rear the higher I go upwind, and if I get wobbly I use front foot pressure to steer more downwind (yet, still upwind), and accelerate. The upwind angle I choose means a range between barely flying and going ~20mph upwind. I can still fly at 16mph or so with the 900 upwind but it's not as stable as 20mph and is a struggle to keep flying.
It's a bit amusing to read this thread. You guys are foiling on different gear and at different levels, but nevertheless give the impression that only your technique can be right, and anything else must be wrong.
I have also had a session with Andy Brandt were he taught me to go upwind better, using front foot pressure. That worked amazingly well - instead of fighting the entire time to go upwind, I was soon getting angles similar to his. I also often had my top speeds for a session going upwind, but that was partly because I used every gust to pinch upwind more, and/or used going upwind to keep control in heavy gusts.
During that time, Andy was usually foiling noticeably faster than I was, even though we were on similar foils, and he was on a smaller sail. The difference? He was pretty much fully sheeted in, I was not. To get better upwind angles, his tips basically make you sheet in more, and go faster. So you may well need more front foot pressure.
With a different sailing style, things may be quite different. On race foil gear, the style pretty much has to be quite different. So the jibe technique has to be adjusted. The sail-first jibe Andy teaches works beautifully when going slow on freeride foils with small sails. Trying the same technique when going faster than the wind on a race foil and large, cambered sail would be a really stupid idea.
If you want to get maximum VMG upwind on race gear, you'll be pointing just about as high as possible - a few more degrees and you'd stop foiling. That pretty much means you'll have to shift your weight back to stay up, especially compared to beam reaches. But you'll also be going at a much higher upwind angle than a freeride foiler who just learned to go upwind far enough that he can try a jibe during a lesson.
Select to expand quoteboardsurfr said..
It's a bit amusing to read this thread. You guys are foiling on different gear and at different levels, but nevertheless give the impression that only your technique can be right, and anything else must be wrong.
Glad there's some entertainment value, and honestly I'm stepping out because clearly there's a lot I still don't understand about what's going on here.
If I've confused anyone, my apologies.
boardsurfr, hey great to meet an Andy camp alumni!, and thanks for the clarification, that is why I kept listing the equipment I was using, it is the only foiling gear I have used, but knew enough that there were different setups, thanks for explaining the difference between freeride (all I know) and race.
So I got out today to again practice the foiling gybe, but my kit just did not feel right (same problem as yesterday). I have a memory of what winds Andy got me up in on the same kit, and I was not getting up as easily and could feel I was loosing too much speed turning into the gybe. Finally checked the alignment of the wing and stabilizer, sure enough the stab. was a little crooked with one stab. tip about 1/4" lower than the other (left to right). I had lost the plastic side shim recently during disassembly, so decided to use Gorilla clear tape, 4 layers were perfect for aligning stab. with wing and the tape would not get lost like the hard plastic side shim. Problem is the glue was slowly getting squeezed out of the tape. So there I am with no hard plastic, thought of just packing up, then decided to check out the garbage containers along the bay, found a Super Big Gulp cup and plastic worked perfect as a stab. side shim (had a razor blade). Got back out and foil lifted up like I knew it should!, but wind sucked was so gusty, short gusts with pressure variations in the gust that I left after a couple of runs. Just need some clean wind for a day to practice the foiling gybe.
Above it says: "give the impression that only your technique can be right, and anything else must be wrong."
I can confirm that my technique is NOT right. LOL Anybody else's technique is more right than mine. And thus I enjoy reading these posts and trying to learn from them.
I plan to start video recording myself to see if I can figure some things out. I have a Clew-View mount that works pretty well. But I won't post any videos for fear of causing excessive mirth and laughter and derision.
Select to expand quotesegler said..
... But I won't post any videos for fear of causing excessive mirth and laughter and derision.
I feel your social anxiety. Took me years on here to even post a pic. Mad respect for those who post crash reels. Video of me exists but every touch down I see makes me cringe. 
Asking for a friend: how much mirth, laughter and derision is deemed excessive? 
Select to expand quotePaducah said..segler said..
... But I won't post any videos for fear of causing excessive mirth and laughter and derision.
I feel your social anxiety. Took me years on here to even post a pic. Mad respect for those who post crash reels. Video of me exists but every touch down I see makes me cringe.
Asking for a friend: how much mirth, laughter and derision is deemed excessive?
Maybe I won't disappear from this thread, I'll just post pics of what I know is cringe things I did for everyone to throw darts at, take one for the team so to say .
Select to expand quoteaeroegnr said..
Maybe I won't disappear from this thread, I'll just post pics of what I know is cringe things I did for everyone to throw darts at, take one for the team so to say .
Maybe not the hero we want but the hero we need.
Select to expand quotePaducah said..aeroegnr said..
Maybe I won't disappear from this thread, I'll just post pics of what I know is cringe things I did for everyone to throw darts at, take one for the team so to say .
Maybe not the hero we want but the hero we need.
Yeah. This forum cannot be picky about the posters expertise or the validity of their comments . Windfoilers are an endangered species.
of course this means our biases in terms of kit and experience means that most threads tend to end up in the same place eg front versus back foot pressure lol
Last year we often ended up in low aspect versus high aspect front wing debate. Less of that recently, cause I guess more of us have experienced the pros/cons of higher aspect wings and see their value, or perhaps our skills have improved to the point where we can use them more effectively.
Select to expand quotePaducah said..segler said..
... But I won't post any videos for fear of causing excessive mirth and laughter and derision.
I feel your social anxiety. Took me years on here to even post a pic. Mad respect for those who post crash reels. Video of me exists but every touch down I see makes me cringe.
Asking for a friend: how much mirth, laughter and derision is deemed excessive?
Segler: we want videos! I think this crowd is much nicer when commenting about videos/pictures than written posts. One caveat: the crowd becomes a ruthless gang when they see your backyard lawn is not well taken care of.
Select to expand quotePaducah said..jksmurf said..
@Paducah I weight 78kg. For sure where I was tring this was messy, swell one direction wave fetch from the other, wasn't easy conditions and I over-estimated my capabilities, I love gybing a windsurfing board, any size, technically a joy, but this one bit me. Flat water is definitely where I will try next.I use around 85cm mast yep, on a 125L JP SUP Foil with Twin Tracks, no straps.
Speed; yes my big foil isn't made for speed, but I haven't got to a point where I am carving the foil around, I was sort of waiting for it to "surf" around I guess.
Cheers
k.
That's the drawback of big, thick wings is they just don't glide as far. If you have access to an L or even one of the Mediums, you might want to give that a go. They will still have a lot of lift at your size but will glide much further giving you more time to deal with things. A cool part of windfoiling, for me, is that even a big, wide board with a long race fuse carves like a much smaller finned board. You don't have to carve hard (especially at first because they can really whip around hard) but do put a bit of pressure on that back foot as you enter.
If you aren't already doing it, start off with some S turns until you get a feel of the different radii as you change pressure. That's a fun thing to do in swell.
Will give the smaller ones a try and work on the S turns. Been windless here for a while which is annoying, Cheers Paducah. I do have an L, M and a S as well as the XL, the smaller two were primarily for SWMBO but I'd be willing to give them all a try. I kind of like the small board, small sail, big foil concept, hence the big foil.
sorry Typo above; weigh not weight.
Select to expand quotesegler said..
Above it says: "give the impression that only your technique can be right, and anything else must be wrong."
I can confirm that my technique is NOT right. LOL Anybody else's technique is more right than mine. And thus I enjoy reading these posts and trying to learn from them.
I plan to start video recording myself to see if I can figure some things out. I have a Clew-View mount that works pretty well. But I won't post any videos for fear of causing excessive mirth and laughter and derision.
have been thinking about video recording myself too when I am practicing gybes, but was thinking a camera on shore would give a better perspective, based on a few videos I seen here that did that.
Select to expand quotejksmurf said..Paducah said..jksmurf said..
@Paducah I weight 78kg. For sure where I was tring this was messy, swell one direction wave fetch from the other, wasn't easy conditions and I over-estimated my capabilities, I love gybing a windsurfing board, any size, technically a joy, but this one bit me. Flat water is definitely where I will try next.I use around 85cm mast yep, on a 125L JP SUP Foil with Twin Tracks, no straps.
Speed; yes my big foil isn't made for speed, but I haven't got to a point where I am carving the foil around, I was sort of waiting for it to "surf" around I guess.
Cheers
k.
That's the drawback of big, thick wings is they just don't glide as far. If you have access to an L or even one of the Mediums, you might want to give that a go. They will still have a lot of lift at your size but will glide much further giving you more time to deal with things. A cool part of windfoiling, for me, is that even a big, wide board with a long race fuse carves like a much smaller finned board. You don't have to carve hard (especially at first because they can really whip around hard) but do put a bit of pressure on that back foot as you enter.
If you aren't already doing it, start off with some S turns until you get a feel of the different radii as you change pressure. That's a fun thing to do in swell.
Will give the smaller ones a try and work on the S turns. Been windless here for a while which is annoying, Cheers Paducah. I do have an L, M and a S as well as the XL, the smaller two were primarily for SWMBO but I'd be willing to give them all a try. I kind of like the small board, small sail, big foil concept, hence the big foil.
sorry Typo above; weigh not weight.
You aren't that gravitationally challenged - give the L and maybe M a shot. They still have a good bit of area and a pretty thick profile so you'll still have plenty of lift at hand. I'd be curious as to your feedback.
Was able to sneak in a relatively flat water session earlier this week with a 5.4 and the jibes are so, so much fun. I hope you continue to give it a go because that carving sensation is every bit as fun on foil as it is on fin.
I see you proofread your posts later on, too.
The Medium Slim wing
Select to expand quotePaducah said..jksmurf said..Paducah said..jksmurf said..
@Paducah I weight 78kg. For sure where I was tring this was messy, swell one direction wave fetch from the other, wasn't easy conditions and I over-estimated my capabilities, I love gybing a windsurfing board, any size, technically a joy, but this one bit me. Flat water is definitely where I will try next.I use around 85cm mast yep, on a 125L JP SUP Foil with Twin Tracks, no straps.
Speed; yes my big foil isn't made for speed, but I haven't got to a point where I am carving the foil around, I was sort of waiting for it to "surf" around I guess.
Cheers
k.
That's the drawback of big, thick wings is they just don't glide as far. If you have access to an L or even one of the Mediums, you might want to give that a go. They will still have a lot of lift at your size but will glide much further giving you more time to deal with things. A cool part of windfoiling, for me, is that even a big, wide board with a long race fuse carves like a much smaller finned board. You don't have to carve hard (especially at first because they can really whip around hard) but do put a bit of pressure on that back foot as you enter.
If you aren't already doing it, start off with some S turns until you get a feel of the different radii as you change pressure. That's a fun thing to do in swell.
Will give the smaller ones a try and work on the S turns. Been windless here for a while which is annoying, Cheers Paducah. I do have an L, M and a S as well as the XL, the smaller two were primarily for SWMBO but I'd be willing to give them all a try. I kind of like the small board, small sail, big foil concept, hence the big foil.
sorry Typo above; weigh not weight.
You aren't that gravitationally challenged - give the L and maybe M a shot. They still have a good bit of area and a pretty thick profile so you'll still have plenty of lift at hand. I'd be curious as to your feedback.
Was able to sneak in a relatively flat water session earlier this week with a 5.4 and the jibes are so, so much fun. I hope you continue to give it a go because that carving sensation is every bit as fun on foil as it is on fin.
I see you proofread your posts later on, too.
The Medium Slim wing
Nice video, thanks! That NP medium slim wing looks very similar to the AFS F1080 dimension-wise, but you are getting better glide at slower speeds than me, 10 kg difference in body weight (me +10 kg) probably makes a difference.
Actually, I really appreciate videos that show both good and bad stuff. The whole point (I hope) is to learn.
I think the best camera perspective is the clew camera. It shows everything about footwork, sail trim and sheet, and harness. One downside is that the swing weight of the camera is quite noticeable when sailing, but you get used to that. Use a light camera. My GoPro 5 Black weighs one-third that of my Contour+ in its case. I have had good luck with the clue-view.com mount. Solid, safe, and light.
This summer I plan to video my jibe learning curve mostly for myself to see what I do wrong or right. If I have any (good or bad) videos that somebody might actually learn from, or constructively criticize from, I will post them. Otherwise, I might post one or two purely for purposes of mirth, laughter, and derision. My videos will still be a while in coming because the water here in the gorge is still 48F, and I fall in a lot working on jibes. Nobody is gonna learn much from my usual practice of coming down off the foil and completing a planing jibe or pivot jibe. See my short youtube below from Florida last month. Proof that a 200 lb guy can fly the i76 at 11 mph boat speed. Just barely.
I request others of us endangered species of windfoilers do this as well. In fact, a thread dedicated to jibe videos would be a good place to collect it all. Constructive criticism is always welcome. Fortunately, that is what we usually see here. Thanks.
Select to expand quotesegler said..
Actually, I really appreciate videos that show both good and bad stuff. The whole point (I hope) is to learn.
I think the best camera perspective is the clew camera. It shows everything about footwork, sail trim and sheet, and harness. One downside is that the swing weight of the camera is quite noticeable when sailing, but you get used to that. Use a light camera. My GoPro 5 Black weighs one-third that of my Contour+ in its case. I have had good luck with the clue-view.com mount. Solid, safe, and light.
This summer I plan to video my jibe learning curve mostly for myself to see what I do wrong or right. If I have any (good or bad) videos that somebody might actually learn from, or constructively criticize from, I will post them. Otherwise, I might post one or two purely for purposes of mirth, laughter, and derision. My videos will still be a while in coming because the water here in the gorge is still 48F, and I fall in a lot working on jibes. Nobody is gonna learn much from my usual practice of coming down off the foil and completing a planing jibe or pivot jibe. See my short youtube below from Florida last month. Proof that a 200 lb guy can fly the i76 at 11 mph boat speed. Just barely.
I request others of us endangered species of windfoilers do this as well. In fact, a thread dedicated to jibe videos would be a good place to collect it all. Constructive criticism is always welcome. Fortunately, that is what we usually see here. Thanks.
The clew view is great, especially with the 360 which gives a large, adjustable field of view. I usually just sail for ~hour then rest and replace the battery and keep going. The downside (of the 360 vs. regular gopro) is it generates huge files that I don't have storage space for, and editing takes time that I sometimes don't have.
I've learned so much from people commenting on what was my bad stance for a bit, improved some with lessons from Andy, but still have ways to go. And, still more to learn all around. It really helps on the biomechanics side when you think you're doing one thing but it's not optimal and you can go further, or you think your stance is one way but it's not. Sometimes people even in real life will comment one thing but not clearly see what your body is doing (it's happened to me, only a couple of people like Andy and Britt have really nailed some stance things..). It seems to take time to recognize how something feels vs. how it really is.
Maybe that's what I likely have wrong about aspects of foiling. If my stance isn't consistent, or if it is consistently wrong enough, then certain things (like harness lines, foot pressure) aren't really valid? I don't know. I just know that my consistency is not quite there. My awareness of what my body is doing is a lot better than it was, but when I look at videos and compare what is going on vs. others I can tell that I'm still not quite there.
Safety warning: I was on a fin yesterday trying to work on stance and jibes (I think my jibes on a foil are more consistent due to the lack of fin wind here with good frequency), and I came off during a crummy jibe entry and smacked my hand really hard on the GoPro/Mount. I keep it mounted so that the tightening knobs and battery door are on the outside to ensure it is clear of the sail, but that also means it's a hard object that sticks out from the boom to potentially hit with your hands/ribs/face. It bruised my hand pretty good and really hurt for a good 30 minutes. And I said I might post something potentially embarrassing
aeroengr, what has helped me a lot to keep getting into the stance Andy taught me (I know when I am in it, but get out of it by old habit) is to use the exact same setup as I did for the two sessions with Andy, same sail rigged same way, same wing, and similar wind speed so sail feels the same. That is how I realized my stabilizer might be out of alignment with the wing, since everything I could see was good, and could feel something was holding me back a little, but a significant little, and that was the out of alignment stabilizer dragging through the water.
Select to expand quoteSandman1221 said..
aeroengr, what has helped me a lot to keep getting into the stance Andy taught me (I know when I am in it, but get out of it by old habit) is to use the exact same setup as I did for the two sessions with Andy, same sail rigged same way, same wing, and similar wind speed so sail feels the same. That is how I realized my stabilizer might be out of alignment with the wing, I could feel something was holding me back a little, but a significant little.
Yeah it's good that you spotted that and then fixed it with a makeshift shim, saved the session. Having the consistent setup helps a ton!
Select to expand quotePaducah said..jksmurf said..Paducah said..jksmurf said..
@Paducah I weight 78kg. For sure where I was tring this was messy, swell one direction wave fetch from the other, wasn't easy conditions and I over-estimated my capabilities, I love gybing a windsurfing board, any size, technically a joy, but this one bit me. Flat water is definitely where I will try next.I use around 85cm mast yep, on a 125L JP SUP Foil with Twin Tracks, no straps.
Speed; yes my big foil isn't made for speed, but I haven't got to a point where I am carving the foil around, I was sort of waiting for it to "surf" around I guess.
Cheers
k.
That's the drawback of big, thick wings is they just don't glide as far. If you have access to an L or even one of the Mediums, you might want to give that a go. They will still have a lot of lift at your size but will glide much further giving you more time to deal with things. A cool part of windfoiling, for me, is that even a big, wide board with a long race fuse carves like a much smaller finned board. You don't have to carve hard (especially at first because they can really whip around hard) but do put a bit of pressure on that back foot as you enter.
If you aren't already doing it, start off with some S turns until you get a feel of the different radii as you change pressure. That's a fun thing to do in swell.
Will give the smaller ones a try and work on the S turns. Been windless here for a while which is annoying, Cheers Paducah. I do have an L, M and a S as well as the XL, the smaller two were primarily for SWMBO but I'd be willing to give them all a try. I kind of like the small board, small sail, big foil concept, hence the big foil.
sorry Typo above; weigh not weight.
You aren't that gravitationally challenged - give the L and maybe M a shot. They still have a good bit of area and a pretty thick profile so you'll still have plenty of lift at hand. I'd be curious as to your feedback.
Was able to sneak in a relatively flat water session earlier this week with a 5.4 and the jibes are so, so much fun. I hope you continue to give it a go because that carving sensation is every bit as fun on foil as it is on fin.
I see you proofread your posts later on, too.
The Medium Slim wing
Paducah,
I still go back and reference this video from 2019. In fact this is one that I screen captured and then slowed way down to learn from. I do that with all the videos from Balz too, it's a great way to catch the details that happen so fast. I love that both of these influencers work on the upwind transitions. This video and the others of Tyson riding this gear REALLY caught my interest. One of my favorite moments from this vid from Tyson is when he heads up and rolls the Albacore to windward, I know those boats and they are weatherly. Similarly he rolls a fleet of longboards upwind in what looks like sub 12 knots of wind. That board and the ones Balz rides are all north of 6'. Uphaulable, weatherly and uber maneuverable. For Tyson's size that foil is huge. It makes me scratch my head when people with a fraction of these skills gravitate towards tiny boards and really small high aspect foils. To each their own. When I saw this I knew it was the way I wanted to ride and I am grateful for this video because for whatever reason this style doesn't get much attention and I would have not known what is possible.
Select to expand quoteutcminusfour said..Paducah said..jksmurf said..Paducah said..jksmurf said..
@Paducah I weight 78kg. For sure where I was tring this was messy, swell one direction wave fetch from the other, wasn't easy conditions and I over-estimated my capabilities, I love gybing a windsurfing board, any size, technically a joy, but this one bit me. Flat water is definitely where I will try next.I use around 85cm mast yep, on a 125L JP SUP Foil with Twin Tracks, no straps.
Speed; yes my big foil isn't made for speed, but I haven't got to a point where I am carving the foil around, I was sort of waiting for it to "surf" around I guess.
Cheers
k.
That's the drawback of big, thick wings is they just don't glide as far. If you have access to an L or even one of the Mediums, you might want to give that a go. They will still have a lot of lift at your size but will glide much further giving you more time to deal with things. A cool part of windfoiling, for me, is that even a big, wide board with a long race fuse carves like a much smaller finned board. You don't have to carve hard (especially at first because they can really whip around hard) but do put a bit of pressure on that back foot as you enter.
If you aren't already doing it, start off with some S turns until you get a feel of the different radii as you change pressure. That's a fun thing to do in swell.
Will give the smaller ones a try and work on the S turns. Been windless here for a while which is annoying, Cheers Paducah. I do have an L, M and a S as well as the XL, the smaller two were primarily for SWMBO but I'd be willing to give them all a try. I kind of like the small board, small sail, big foil concept, hence the big foil.
sorry Typo above; weigh not weight.
You aren't that gravitationally challenged - give the L and maybe M a shot. They still have a good bit of area and a pretty thick profile so you'll still have plenty of lift at hand. I'd be curious as to your feedback.
Was able to sneak in a relatively flat water session earlier this week with a 5.4 and the jibes are so, so much fun. I hope you continue to give it a go because that carving sensation is every bit as fun on foil as it is on fin.
I see you proofread your posts later on, too.
The Medium Slim wing
Paducah,
I still go back and reference this video from 2019. In fact this is one that I screen captured and then slowed way down to learn from. I do that with all the videos from Balz too, it's a great way to catch the details that happen so fast. I love that both of these influencers work on the upwind transitions. This video and the others of Tyson riding this gear REALLY caught my interest. One of my favorite moments from this vid from Tyson is when he heads up and rolls the Albacore to windward, I know those boats and they are weatherly. Similarly he rolls a fleet of longboards upwind in what looks like sub 12 knots of wind. That board and the ones Balz rides are all north of 6'. Uphaulable, weatherly and uber maneuverable. For Tyson's size that foil is huge. It makes me scratch my head when people with a fraction of these skills gravitate towards tiny boards and really small high aspect foils. To each their own. When I saw this I knew it was the way I wanted to ride and I am grateful for this video because for whatever reason this style doesn't get much attention and I would have not known what is possible.
That's an incredible video. The foiling 360s and just smoothness is fantastic. Makes me want to do even more sail handling practice so that I'm not a total muppet.
Sandman,
While the span is the same there are some differences between the wings. The glide has more area and a lower aspect ratio. When viewed from head on the glide has much less curvature (the wings turn down less on the glide) so more area is devoted to lift rather than stability. I can't find the thickness info but my guess is the glide is thicker even with the slim naming (Paducah can you measure?). All of these details make the glide have a much lower take off speed and a much lower stall speed. These are REALLY desirable qualities. I know you love speed and that's cool but a wing like the glide may be just what you need to help you master your gybes. It made a huge difference for me when I switched from Horue XL to Moses 790. Keep in mind I am just trying to help, not put you down. I appreciate your energy for this subject!
Below is an overlay that I created from marketing info online.
Select to expand quotesegler said..
Actually, I really appreciate videos that show both good and bad stuff. The whole point (I hope) is to learn.
I think the best camera perspective is the clew camera. It shows everything about footwork, sail trim and sheet, and harness. One downside is that the swing weight of the camera is quite noticeable when sailing, but you get used to that. Use a light camera. My GoPro 5 Black weighs one-third that of my Contour+ in its case. I have had good luck with the clue-view.com mount. Solid, safe, and light.
This summer I plan to video my jibe learning curve mostly for myself to see what I do wrong or right. If I have any (good or bad) videos that somebody might actually learn from, or constructively criticize from, I will post them. Otherwise, I might post one or two purely for purposes of mirth, laughter, and derision. My videos will still be a while in coming because the water here in the gorge is still 48F, and I fall in a lot working on jibes. Nobody is gonna learn much from my usual practice of coming down off the foil and completing a planing jibe or pivot jibe. See my short youtube below from Florida last month. Proof that a 200 lb guy can fly the i76 at 11 mph boat speed. Just barely.
I request others of us endangered species of windfoilers do this as well. In fact, a thread dedicated to jibe videos would be a good place to collect it all. Constructive criticism is always welcome. Fortunately, that is what we usually see here. Thanks.
That set up looks pretty good. Looks like it is gybable if that is something you want to go for.
Select to expand quoteutcminusfour said..
Sandman,
While the span is the same there are some differences between the wings. The glide has more area and a lower aspect ratio. When viewed from head on the glide has much less curvature (the wings turn down less on the glide) so more area is devoted to lift rather than stability. I can't find the thickness info but my guess is the glide is thicker even with the slim naming (Paducah can you measure?). All of these details make the glide have a much lower take off speed and a much lower stall speed. These are REALLY desirable qualities. I know you love speed and that's cool but a wing like the glide may be just what you need to help you master your gybes. It made a huge difference for me when I switched from Horue XL to Moses 790. Keep in mind I am just trying to help, not put you down. I appreciate your energy for this subject!
Below is an overlay that I created from marketing info online.
Thanks UTC, that slim medium wing looks identical in shape to the F1080!, the cord on F1080 is 6.5"/ 16.5 cm on the wing at the saddle and just off the saddle. AFS determined the aspect ratio for F1080 wing (5.9) using this formula aspect ratio = span squared/surface area. Using that same formula the aspect ratio for slim medium wing is 5.2. So they are both close in AR too.
By the way, I record all videos at 720p and nothing higher than that. This keeps the files relatively small. Rendering and editing is relatively fast. I have found that 1080p and higher is a waste of pixels for most uses such as youtube posting or for me studying my mistakes on a computer screen. (No, VGA 640x480 is too low.)
If you want to watch your creations on a modern TV where you can make out individual peach fuzz on your hairy legs, then yes, 4k and up is great.
Sandman, that is the 1080 overlayed on top of the glide and they are really different. My calc was span/cord, my bad there is more than one way to look at that metric. Even with apples to apples AR calc I fail to see how these wings are "nearly identical". I am here to have fun and help folks when I can so I will let this go.
Cheers mate, keep charging!
The Moses 790 is 4.03 AR
Delta shaped with a very low stall speed it will all most stop before it falls.
It turns easy and glides I can hold speed with guys on higher AP wings.
It's a jibing machine
Select to expand quotesegler said..
Actually, I really appreciate videos that show both good and bad stuff. The whole point (I hope) is to learn.
I think the best camera perspective is the clew camera. It shows everything about footwork, sail trim and sheet, and harness. One downside is that the swing weight of the camera is quite noticeable when sailing, but you get used to that. Use a light camera. My GoPro 5 Black weighs one-third that of my Contour+ in its case. I have had good luck with the clue-view.com mount. Solid, safe, and light.
This summer I plan to video my jibe learning curve mostly for myself to see what I do wrong or right. If I have any (good or bad) videos that somebody might actually learn from, or constructively criticize from, I will post them. Otherwise, I might post one or two purely for purposes of mirth, laughter, and derision. My videos will still be a while in coming because the water here in the gorge is still 48F, and I fall in a lot working on jibes. Nobody is gonna learn much from my usual practice of coming down off the foil and completing a planing jibe or pivot jibe. See my short youtube below from Florida last month. Proof that a 200 lb guy can fly the i76 at 11 mph boat speed. Just barely.
I request others of us endangered species of windfoilers do this as well. In fact, a thread dedicated to jibe videos would be a good place to collect it all. Constructive criticism is always welcome. Fortunately, that is what we usually see here. Thanks.
If you flew higher on the mast you'd be faster, and you'd have no problem gybing on the foil.
Select to expand quotePaducah said..
You aren't that gravitationally challenged - give the L and maybe M a shot. They still have a good bit of area and a pretty thick profile so you'll still have plenty of lift at hand. I'd be curious as to your feedback.
Was able to sneak in a relatively flat water session earlier this week with a 5.4 and the jibes are so, so much fun. I hope you continue to give it a go because that carving sensation is every bit as fun on foil as it is on fin.
I see you proofread your posts later on, too.
The Medium Slim wing
Tyson Poor... now that's just showing off :-). Bet it sells stuff though! (Typos - yeah I hate messing it up, feels a bit sloppy).
Will feed back when I get out there hopefully this weekend... will be first time back since my Feb 3rd ankle breakage. I never really thought about carving a foil I always thought you lose lift but I guess speed keeps the thing up for long enough.
