Select to expand quoteFlying Dutchman said..myscreenname said..
You and that Dutch guy are yesterday's men.
This possible lab leak has cost the lives of almost as many people as World War I. Including excess deaths, around 20 million have died.
You're going to be pissed when you realise you took the clot shots to fix a gain of function fuc up while lining the pockets of pharma at the possible expense of your health.
www.city-journal.org/article/new-documents-bolster-lab-leak-hypothesis
Wait....
You think that just because it escaped from a lab that taking precautions to prevent serious illness was unnecessary?
Select to expand quoteCarantoc said..
meh, yeah, I'll keep reading it as non-tramatic deaths within 30 days of a covid-19 positive test.
Do you apply the same analytical standard to data in the TGA vaccine adverse events database?
Select to expand quoteD3 said..
Wait....
You think that just because it escaped from a lab that taking precautions to prevent serious illness was unnecessary?
There was no lab leak, Remery already said it's a conspiracy theory.
If the government was serious about preventing serious illness they would mandate shutting down Maccas, bottle shops & crispy kremes, but take 8 boosters instead, you can still eat fried chicken out of a bucket driving your fat ass to the Dr for your next hit of Ozempic.
"People are more likely to believe myths, rumors, and conspiracies that have no scientific evidence due to their behavior of seeking information and their concerns about their health. When it comes to the reliability of content, consumers could be put in danger when misinformation is widely disseminated over social media platforms."
www.ajpor.org/article/94428
Select to expand quoteremery said..
Do you apply the same analytical standard to data in the TGA vaccine adverse events database?
If I ever looked up or considered data in the TGA database I may well do so. All depends on what the data is and what it represents.
But I definetly would to graphs made up by somebody to show Trump is a ****-wit and Biden is awesome.
Why ? Do you assess politically motivated, statistically manipulated graphs memes with the same analytical standard as TGA databases ?
Select to expand quotepsychojoe said..
Yeah, it previously was only disseminated over broadcast media.
Well, it was also dissemenated by the church. In fact, for most of the last 2000 years it mainly came from the church.
Pretty sure that, to date, the various churches have done more to disseminate myths, rumors, and conspiracies that have no scientific evidence, than social media has.
Although when people are so blikered and have so much belief in 'science' that they consider the 'science' they want to be true to be dogma, then what's the difference to dogma ?
I mean, somebody above said you have to believe the science and you are not allowed to consider anything yourself, because some particular scientist saying it knows more than you do. So what they say is right, no questions or alternate view allowed.
Interesting. Because that is exactly the same thing PM33's priest says to him.
Select to expand quoteCarantoc said..
Well, it was also dissemenated by the church. In fact, for most of the last 2000 years it mainly came from the church.
Pretty sure that, to date, the various churches have done more to disseminate myths, rumors, and conspiracies that have no scientific evidence, than social media has.
Although when people are so blikered and have so much belief in 'science' that they consider the 'science' they want to be true to be dogma, then what's the difference to dogma ?
I mean, somebody above said you have to believe the science and you are not allowed to consider anything yourself, because some particular scientist saying it knows more than you do. So what they say is right, no questions or alternate view allowed.
Interesting. Because that is exactly the same thing PM33's priest says to him.
You seem to be a wannabe scientist You would do well to look into Karl Popper...
"Karl Popper (1902-1994) was one of the most influential philosophers of science of the 20th century. He made significant contributions to debates concerning general scientific methodology and theory choice, the demarcation of science from non-science, the nature of probability and quantum mechanics, and the methodology of the social sciences. His work is notable for its wide influence both within the philosophy of science, within science itself, and within a broader social context.
Popper's early work attempts to solve the problem of demarcation and offer a clear criterion that distinguishes scientific theories from metaphysical or mythological claims. Popper's falsificationist methodology holds that scientific theories are characterized by entailing predictions that future observations might reveal to be false. When theories are falsified by such observations, scientists can respond by revising the theory, or by rejecting the theory in favor of a rival or by maintaining the theory as is and changing an auxiliary hypothesis. In either case, however, this process must aim at the production of new, falsifiable predictions, while Popper recognizes that scientists can and do hold onto theories in the face of failed predictions when there are no predictively superior rivals to turn to. He holds that scientific practice is characterized by its continual effort to test theories against experience and make revisions based on the outcomes of these tests. By contrast, theories that are permanently immunized from falsification by the introduction of untestable ad hoc hypotheses can no longer be classified as scientific. Among other things, Popper argues that his falsificationist proposal allows for a solution of the problem of induction, since inductive reasoning plays no role in his account of theory choice.
Along with his general proposals regarding falsification and scientific methodology, Popper is notable for his work on probability and quantum mechanics and on the methodology of the social sciences. Popper defends a propensity theory of probability, according to which probabilities are interpreted as objective, mind-independent properties of experimental setups. Popper then uses this theory to provide a realist interpretation of quantum mechanics, though its applicability goes beyond this specific case. With respect to the social sciences, Popper argued against the historicist attempt to formulate universal laws covering the whole of human history and instead argued in favor of methodological individualism and situational logic."
If you were a true scientist Remery you wouldn't be calling the Lab Leak a conspiracy theory. The case is not closed.
Select to expand quoteFlying Dutchman said..
If you were a true scientist Remery you wouldn't be calling the Lab Leak a conspiracy theory.
I can't remember, "calling the Lab Leak a conspiracy theory". But tell me, how do you define a "true scientist"?
Select to expand quoteremery said..
I can't remember, "calling the Lab Leak a conspiracy theory".
Wow your cognitive dissonance is outstanding.
Select to expand quoteFlying Dutchman said..
Wow your cognitive dissonance is outstanding.
Now you are just making stuff up... again.
You know there is a difference between, deliberate lab leak and, (unlikely) accidental laboratory leak right?
Select to expand quoteremery said..Flying Dutchman said..
Wow your cognitive dissonance is outstanding.
Now you are just making stuff up... again.
You know there is a difference between, deliberate lab leak and, (unlikely) accidental laboratory leak right?
... and I think it makes sense to note that a 'conspiracy' is where someone intends to do something, and the other could be someone just stuffed up. People do it all the time unless you also think Chernobyl was planned.
Just for the sake of it, I go along with the idea it was an accidental lab leak, just because I saw reports of the US intelligence agencies noting that they saw a lack of cars parked there all of a sudden and somehow detected much less cellular phone traffic than normal also. Of course, they could be making all this up to deflect us from realising it was really an alien conspiracy..
but, someone stuffing up and then everyone getting the heck out of there seems to match human behavior.
How about the conspiracy of the whole world being told it was a bat soup and if you suggested otherwise you were a labelled a conspiracy theorist. Now we're in 2024 and all of a sudden we're all on the same page. Amazing stuff.
Oh good, now that we've swung back around to conspiracy theories, I can revive my Boeing crashMax theory. Which is that the virus was released to ground all aircraft so that Boeing wouldn't lose market share to Airbus after the MCAS crashes. And if too many more doors fall off, what then? Another variant? Or maybe the doors was just a way of the U.S. welcoming Comac into the market and returning the favour to China after they helped with the virus. Oh yeah, down the rabbit hole!
And before you dismiss it instantly, check the alignment of the crash dates and virus dates, then the ungrounding date with the vaccine date. Sure, there's nothing in it but still entirely plausible.
Select to expand quoteFlying Dutchman said..
How about the conspiracy of the whole world being told it was a bat soup and if you suggested otherwise you were a labelled a conspiracy theorist. Now we're in 2024 and all of a sudden we're all on the same page. Amazing stuff.
I think that also shows that you are not reading things correctly. Are you sure we are all on the same page? I doubt it.
Conspiracy theories tend to be vague, so how do you know what was said? What did you specifically say at the time so that we can analyse that? Have you seen how evasive some are when you ask them about 'what is going to happen'? The response I have seen seems to be 'you will know when you see it', or 'just wait, it will happen'.
I remember posting that thing about the US intelligence agencies thinking it was an issue at Wuhan as everything there went quiet at the facility. It made sense to me at the time and still does.
CT nutters on the otherhand will still be thinking that it was an intended spread of the virus after it was altered to be more aggressive and that it was let out to kill off people so that the world's richest people can live with many less people on the planet.
They also seem to think (ineffective) remedies are being blocked so that we the public are denied protection. Sure Ivermectin works if you dose the virus with an extrememly high human dose, but only in a testtube. Donald Trump said so.
On the same page? I don't think so.
Now, we seem to be heading to WW3 according to some and what will happen? Well, they can't say because they don't know, but if you prophetize "something", 'something' does happen.
"The hypotheses of that origin are a zoonotic origin or a possible leak of this coronavirus from a laboratory. According to the reviewed papers, there is much greater scientific support for the first one. Conclusion: The main gap in the zoonotic hypothesis is the lack of a detected intermediate host, which has not been found yet. In turn, although the hypothesis of a laboratory leak has not been supported by sufficient scientific evidence, it cannot be definitively discarded."
www.acquaintpublications.com/get/1-5-JCMPHR2024010104%20Galley_Proof-1706172585.pdf
Select to expand quoteFormulaNova said..
I think that also shows that you are not reading things correctly. Are you sure we are all on the same page? I doubt it.
Conspiracy theories tend to be vague, so how do you know what was said? What did you specifically say at the time so that we can analyse that? Have you seen how evasive some are when you ask them about 'what is going to happen'? The response I have seen seems to be 'you will know when you see it', or 'just wait, it will happen'.
I remember posting that thing about the US intelligence agencies thinking it was an issue at Wuhan as everything there went quiet at the facility. It made sense to me at the time and still does.
CT nutters on the otherhand will still be thinking that it was an intended spread of the virus after it was altered to be more aggressive and that it was let out to kill off people so that the world's richest people can live with many less people on the planet.
They also seem to think (ineffective) remedies are being blocked so that we the public are denied protection. Sure Ivermectin works if you dose the virus with an extrememly high human dose, but only in a testtube. Donald Trump said so.
On the same page? I don't think so.
Now, we seem to be heading to WW3 according to some and what will happen? Well, they can't say because they don't know, but if you prophetize "something", 'something' does happen.
Wow I'm so sorry I doubted you FN, you've been right all along about the possibility of a Lab Leak. I can't believe I was so ignorant.
I was just trusting the science.
amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jun/09/conspiracies-covid-19-lab-false-pandemic
"Occam's Razor Simplified - The idiom "when you hear hoofbeats think horses, not zebras" refers to this principle that the most likely solution is the simplest one. This is not because simpler explanations are usually correct, but because you make fewer assumptions when looking for horses instead of zebras."
Select to expand quoteFlying Dutchman said..
Wow I'm so sorry I doubted you FN, you've been right all along about the possibility of a Lab Leak. I can't believe I was so ignorant.
I was just trusting the science.
amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jun/09/conspiracies-covid-19-lab-false-pandemic
That newspaper story is almost 4 years old.
Select to expand quoteremery said..
That newspaper story is almost 4 years old.
Yes Remery I know, just highlighting what the public was fed.
Select to expand quoteremery said..
That newspaper story is almost 4 years old.
Yesterday's man, living in the past.
www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp2305081
"Of the three possibilities - natural, accidental, or deliberate - the most scientific evidence yet identified supports natural emergence. More than half of the earliest Covid-19 cases were connected to the Huanan market, and epidemiologic mapping revealed that the concentration of cases was centered there. In January 2020, Chinese officials cleared the market without testing live animals, but positive environmental samples, including those from an animal cage and a hair-and-feather-removal machine, indicated the presence of both SARS-CoV-2 and Covid-susceptible animals.5 Recently released findings included raccoon dog DNA, pointing to a possible SARS-CoV-2 progenitor. Samples from early cases in humans also contained two different SARS-CoV-2 lineages. Although only one lineage spread globally, the existence of multiple lineages suggests that a SARS-CoV-2 epidemic in animals may have led to multiple spillover events.
Proponents of the accidental laboratory leak theory stress the geographic location of the WIV in the city where the pandemic began. They point to the presence of the bat coronavirus RaTG13 strain at the laboratory, arguing that genetic manipulations such as gain-of-function (GOF) research may have produced SARS-CoV-2. Most scientists refute this theory because there is considerable evolutionary distance between the two viruses. However, the possibility that the laboratory held a different progenitor strain to SARS-CoV-2 that led to a laboratory leak cannot be unequivocally ruled out."
This opens the possibility of deliberate.
Why were early sequences deleted and hidden during a pandemic? It's toward the end of the article.
www.scientificamerican.com/article/deleted-coronavirus-genome-sequences-trigger-scientific-intrigue/
I get the impression, the knee jerk reaction from minor Chinese officials, is "cover-up".
But that could just be from western propaganda
Select to expand quoteremery said..
"Occam's Razor Simplified - The idiom "when you hear hoofbeats think horses, not zebras" refers to this principle that the most likely solution is the simplest one. This is not because simpler explanations are usually correct, but because you make fewer assumptions when looking for horses instead of zebras."
Male zebras also drown baby zebras so they can bang the now childless mother.
not sure if it's relevant to this conversation but something to think about.
Select to expand quoteFlying Dutchman said..fangman said..
It's clear from this meme that you didn't do any research on what it takes to be funny.
Ok FD I tried to do my own research. Is this any better?
Select to expand quotemyscreenname said..remery said..
That newspaper story is almost 4 years old.
Yesterday's man, living in the past.
Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.
Select to expand quotePcdefender said..
Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.
"In 2023, the region's 40 member states reported some 42,200 measles cases, up from fewer than 1,000 in 2022. The rise in cases is also the result of declining national vaccination rates, which fell from 92%, on average, in 2019 to 91% in 2022, according to the WHO."
Stupid is as stupid does.
