Just put another crack on my board today. Was wondering who makes tough boards in the 80L range. I've had three boards, one v1 Starboard, and 2 custom carbon boards. I'm too rough with the custom boards and have put several dents, cracks and holes in them. The current board needs to go back to the ding shop to deal with three cracks.
So I'm thinking of getting a tough production board. Where should I be looking? Armstrong? PPC? Go Foil?...
Have you considered an inflatable board? Also, the Slingshot Manticore is compression molded, the smallest size is 90L.
In terms of production boards, I've observed that Appletree is consistently highly regarded for their construction and specifically, the foam they use.
Select to expand quoteWindbot said..
Have you considered an inflatable board? Also, the Slingshot Manticore is compression molded, the smallest size is 90L.
Thanks, inflatables don't do so well in the ocean chop here on Maui. I'll see if some one carries slingshot or Appletree around here.
Had a custom 74ltr built, no carbon was my request as I was sick of cracks. One layer of ineggra, one layer of 6oz S glass. 18months on, no cracks, a few heal dents but it's very light at 5kgs so to be expected. I'd rather a few heal dents rather than a heavy board. It's a Carbonco Vulcan.
Mojo boards Hungary are really really strong custom boards .
search you tube for Mojo impact test , which shows the guy hitting the board with a hammer .
should be tough enough for most people .
I've had mine for two years now and not a mark despite being washed onto the rocks once !
Goofcat - I'm on Oahu - Paul Cooper is an Appletree dealer. You can get a hold of him via Instagram.
I've repaired a couple of his old boards that he sold to my buddy - Majek foilboards. Standard construction - lots of heel dents.
And my buddy bought a couple of the Appletree-Majek collabs - those are built really well and are light.
It looks like the Naish shop has some really good deals on their wing boards also -
You can't have both bombproof and lightweight, any brand can build a board that is virtually indestructible, but it will be heavy and horrible to ride. I checked out the Appletree boards, 1/2 kilo heavier than a light board. So you need to decide what is important, cosmetics or quality of the ride.
Personally, carbon is way overrated for boards, just makes them stiff, brittle and quite dead feeling on the water. You won't find a surfer using a carbon board.
I had an Appletree and sold it.
I did love the build quality and shape, they use XPS foam so if you crack the lam you can keep sailing.They are waterproof unlike EPS (little balls).
But XPS is 32gr/m3.
My 83l was 6.1kg, a custom EPS is 5.2kg or so.
In boards with some volume weight is a killer for me, i never enjoyed that board.For 50lt boards and below maybe it does not matter that much.
Takoon and Levitaz also use waterproof foam, i think they are all built in the same factory in Portugal.
I got a production 6'1" x 25 108lt One Egg for dw, but it's a bit low volume for my weight so I ended up trying it as a wing board. Worked so well I sold my other much shorter wingboard. Toughest construction I have seen in a production board but still among the lightest.
Not at all affiliated and I paid full price. If One puts out a longer narrower higher volume dw range I will happily get (another) one.
I got the Takoon Glide V2 in 55l. Weight ist 4.7 kg. I really like the board, because it's super stiff. This gives a more direct feel to the foil. I would not compare foilboards to surfboards in terms of materials. In surfboards you want a little flex, in foilboards you don't.
I have been riding a Jimmy Lewis VM 75L & 95L for 12 months no dings or cracks super durable and they feel light.
Select to expand quotemcrt said..
I had an Appletree and sold it.
I did love the build quality and shape, they use XPS foam so if you crack the lam you can keep sailing.They are waterproof unlike EPS (little balls).
But XPS is 32gr/m3.
My 83l was 6.1kg, a custom EPS is 5.2kg or so.
In boards with some volume weight is a killer for me, i never enjoyed that board.For 50lt boards and below maybe it does not matter that much.
Takoon and Levitaz also use waterproof foam, i think they are all built in the same factory in Portugal.
It's funny, for me heavier at a certain extend boards are good in keeping a good bank turns, keeping momentum while gliding in dw or bottom turning into the flat etc.However, I feel it's negativity when I do just pump the board or I want to break a carve quickly. So for me it's not just negative.I was in a shop with a lot of different brands...some big names in winging are just eggshells, ridiculously fragile. I assume the longer the board, the more you feel the weight maybe?
Mentioned before. I'm riding an Appletree Slice V2. Might be a little heavier than other 83liter boards but is durable, strong and if you can crack it, the foam doesn't absorb water. Due to the construction method the foilboxes are rock solid as well.
Because the majority of the weight is in the foam used, weight becomes a bigger thing in larger boards. Then again, I rode a Downwind skipper prototype the other day. It didn't feel heavier than my JP foil sup with the same volume, but feels a lot stiffer.
Appletree own it's own production facility in Portugal. They also build boards for other brands (Levitaz, Omen, Kold) and some in collaboration (Majek).
the 2023 Fanatic TE boards are full carbon sandwich... built like a windsurf board. So far no issues. Not super light but the 75l weighs in at ~13lbs
Interesting discussion. I don't quite understand why anyone would use carbon in a board that's likely to be jumped. Cracks instead of heel dents? I'd also love to see a blind test between boards weighing 5 vs. 6 kg. I can see that the weight may matter if you do trick jumps, but how much difference does this really make when foiling? Would a 80-90 kg foiler standing centered on a ~ 5 ft long, ~ 2 ft wide board really feel any effects of the board weight difference while on the water? Construction wise, the difference could be quite dramatic, with full vs. minimal reinforcements, and the resulting differences in durability.
Select to expand quoteGoofcat said..Windbot said..
Have you considered an inflatable board? Also, the Slingshot Manticore is compression molded, the smallest size is 90L.
Thanks, inflatables don't do so well in the ocean chop here on Maui. I'll see if some one carries slingshot or Appletree around here.
That's too bad, they work great in Gorge swell and mainland coastal and lake conditions.
Select to expand quoteboardsurfr said..
Interesting discussion. I don't quite understand why anyone would use carbon in a board that's likely to be jumped. Cracks instead of heel dents? I'd also love to see a blind test between boards weighing 5 vs. 6 kg. I can see that the weight may matter if you do trick jumps, but how much difference does this really make when foiling? Would a 80-90 kg foiler standing centered on a ~ 5 ft long, ~ 2 ft wide board really feel any effects of the board weight difference while on the water? Construction wise, the difference could be quite dramatic, with full vs. minimal reinforcements, and the resulting differences in durability.
It makes a huge difference, believe me i did not want to sell that Appletree so soon...i lost money on the experiment.
A lighter board makes you feel the foil in a much more direct way, with less lag due to inertia everything is easier.
Coming up on foil,turns ,maneuvers,going fast ,dealing with chop,pumping through holes etc...
And yes,jumps.But jumps are secondary for me, i only do chop hops and mostly to clear seaweed.
It is just way more fun.
IMHO anybody with a mid level (tacks,gybes) is going to feel a kg of difference, and half a kg too.
Select to expand quotemcrt said..boardsurfr said..
Interesting discussion. I don't quite understand why anyone would use carbon in a board that's likely to be jumped. Cracks instead of heel dents? I'd also love to see a blind test between boards weighing 5 vs. 6 kg. I can see that the weight may matter if you do trick jumps, but how much difference does this really make when foiling? Would a 80-90 kg foiler standing centered on a ~ 5 ft long, ~ 2 ft wide board really feel any effects of the board weight difference while on the water? Construction wise, the difference could be quite dramatic, with full vs. minimal reinforcements, and the resulting differences in durability.
It makes a huge difference, believe me i did not want to sell that Appletree so soon...i lost money on the experiment.
A lighter board makes you feel the foil in a much more direct way, with less lag due to inertia everything is easier.
Coming up on foil,turns ,maneuvers,going fast ,dealing with chop,pumping through holes etc...
And yes,jumps.But jumps are secondary for me, i only do chop hops and mostly to clear seaweed.
It is just way more fun.
IMHO anybody with a mid level (tacks,gybes) is going to feel a kg of difference, and half a kg too.
mcrt is on it, weight makes a huge difference. We have big bay swells and you're often pumping though flatter sections so it is imperative to be on a light boards. And with boards becoming narrower and longer this automatically means more swing weight so light weight construction is a must.
If you want a high performance ride accept the occasional ding or heal dent. XPS foam is great for not taking on water if you get a crack, but why not avoid the crack in the first place by not using carbon. My choice is ineggra, it's tough and light, cheap too, but you will need to find a local board builder to use it.
I have an Appletree Jazz 62. It is as solid as a rock. My other boards are in and out of repairs and they gain weight with every new patch. The Jazz I find to be great for getting up on foil. At 78kg in wetsuit, I do not need to use the stinkbug with my 62 Jazz. I just get on the board and raise the wing with the boom to get some lift, no need for very strong wind either. Great board for jumps, learning new tricks and getting up on foil quickly.
This board has been thrown at rocks and pebble beaches. No issues. I take it to all the trips without worrying that I will need to patch it on arrival or after a session.
Compared to lighter boards of the same size, I really do not feel that much difference (and I do jump with Jazz). I also agree with NordRoi that there is a plus in it. For some elements, it is more comfortable to have the feeling of the board, not just the foil.
The eggshell feeling of some top boards is not very comfortable (sorry, Axis, Armie). I do not want to worry about nicking a board during a session. This Jazz is a keeper. I am sure it will outlive my other boards.
Re Appletree, I'm another believer. I've had a lot of boards and I got tired of dealing with headaches. Dings on the beach, dings travelling, stiffness compromising, etc... Yes the Appletree is slightly heavier, but it is far more solid and I feel that stiffness is measurably superior than anything else that I've tried. Furthermore, with several brands I found that the track connection "softened" over time - particularly with the stress of repeated jumping. That is not the case with the Appletree, where the stiffness holds up over time. I think stiffness longevity is a greatly overlooked aspect of "durability".
For what it's worth, Armstrong FG boards are pretty good, relatively light, very strong and stiff, foil boxes are in the right place and long enough.
My 34L surf version was through a lot ( ~2 years old), no cracks or dings, the only thing I keep fixing is the pad on the deck.
My 60L SUP version cracked while pumping a while back (was replaced by warranty), they've added an extra layer to the sup boards since. Didn't have any dramas with the updated sup version.
Select to expand quoteSilverFoilSurfer said..
For what it's worth, Armstrong FG boards are pretty good, relatively light, very strong and stiff, foil boxes are in the right place and long enough.
My 34L surf version was through a lot ( ~2 years old), no cracks or dings, the only thing I keep fixing is the pad on the deck.
My 60L SUP version cracked while pumping a while back (was replaced by warranty), they've added an extra layer to the sup boards since. Didn't have any dramas with the updated sup version.
Hi!
I have Armstrong 39L. It is a little delicate. I have to take extra care when getting out of the swell. When thrown onto the pebble beach by a wave it gets decent dings.
BUT! Armstrong 39 is an excellent sinker board. Very very light. Yet, it is longer than my 62 Jazz. So in turns at least, the extra width adds to the inertia (theoretically that is... in reality, I am not that good to notice it). Don't get me started on those handles though :-)
Select to expand quoteGoofcat said..
Just put another crack on my board today. Was wondering who makes tough boards in the 80L range. I've had three boards, one v1 Starboard, and 2 custom carbon boards. I'm too rough with the custom boards and have put several dents, cracks and holes in them. The current board needs to go back to the ding shop to deal with three cracks.
So I'm thinking of getting a tough production board. Where should I be looking? Armstrong? PPC? Go Foil?...
I have a couple of Kalama E3's and they are standing up well after a year or so. Good compromise of weight to strength.
As someone who loathes nuisance dings and spending every second week at the repair shop I can highly recommend PPC boards, they can definitely take a knock . Made in a well known factory in Vietnam, they have a well deserved reputation here in NZ for lightness but also toughness. Mine is still pristine after a few months use now. My mate had his cartwheel down the beach after being caught by a swirling gust while unattended , it ended up smacking into a log. Result was a ridiculously minor superficial crack at the rear corner , something you could repair yourself. Lots of other boards would have had some pretty major damage after an incident like that.
If you want a really impact-resistant board...
... an inflatable can be a solution!
Now they even exist in the new "cigar" (aka downwind, low wind, ..) shapes:
Select to expand quotecolas said..
If you want a really impact-resistant board...
... an inflatable can be a solution!
Now they even exist in the new "cigar" (aka downwind, low wind, ..) shapes:
OMG nice!!!
Select to expand quotecolas said..
If you want a really impact-resistant board...
... an inflatable can be a solution!
Now they even exist in the new "cigar" (aka downwind, low wind, ..) shapes:
This makes sense for this "cumbersome" shaped DW boards.
Nice move by Gong, they are gonna sell like icecream this summer :)
Thanks for all the replies. I'll go take a look at the Kalama, as they carry it at my surf shop. No luck finding Appletree, but did find an Omen, will try to check it out. No PPC on Maui, will check them out when I'm in Oahu next time. Never seen a Gong, and not a fan of Naish so they aren't on the list.
My current board is 4'10" x 25, 80L for my 90kgs. I have no problems getting up on foil (Armstrong HA 1125). How much of a difference will the narrow long boards make? I really like being able to fit all my gear inside my car. Anything over 6 feet will need to go on the rack.
Select to expand quotecolas said..
If you want a really impact-resistant board...
... an inflatable can be a solution!
Now they even exist in the new "cigar" (aka downwind, low wind, ..) shapes:
I really hope it has straps and some actual rail shape, if so that'll be perfect!
