Also Im thinking about whether your trying to hit the ramp or smooth the ride. If you look at good downhill skiers or dirtbikers at speed there'sa bit of pre-jump that takes the sting out of the chop and is less fatigueing. As Troy said go a biy bigger on the fin will help ride off the water a bit.
Select to expand quotesailpilot said..
Also Im thinking about whether your trying to hit the ramp or smooth the ride. If you look at good downhill skiers or dirtbikers at speed there'sa bit of pre-jump that takes the sting out of the chop and is less fatigueing. As Troy said go a biy bigger on the fin will help ride off the water a bit.
Cheers Phil, I think I need to look at some basic things first like tuning rig and harness etc. and making small adjustments during each session.
OW forgot to ask ,but do use a adjustable out haul system ,setting the right power in the sail is important in choppy conditions .
I went back to using one 4 years back ,as i use to sit on my board out to sea ,unplug then adjust the outhaul then plug up and sail off again ,until this big black thing kept swimming around me ,now I very rarely stop ,and find myself adjusting outhaul almost every run
to match swell ,wind shadows ,and avoid dangling legs ha ha .I don't think i can do without a outhaul system ever again ,it just provides a lot more comfort in sailing ,max downhaul high carbon mast and and just play with the outhaul ,I've only discovered carbon fins are also a pleasure in chop and overpowered conditions ,makes sense really as our high carbon mast are more forgiving and nicer to use ,so why didn't i think where my weight power is going ,and thats in the fin ,I'M am slowly changing some of my fins to carbon ..you just need lots of $ ,flat water i still enjoy a G10 .
Select to expand quotesailpilot said..
Also Im thinking about whether your trying to hit the ramp or smooth the ride. If you look at good downhill skiers or dirtbikers at speed there'sa bit of pre-jump that takes the sting out of the chop and is less fatigueing.
Thats good advice. Try and keep the use of the harness & arms the same as on flat water. I find if I bottle it and take more on my arms and commit less to the harness I just spin out and explode. Its all in the head. Definitely need less power in the sail than flat water though.
I'm not sure about the larger fin advice. Its the same as power from the sail, you dont want too much.
At one place I sail at in Poole Bay UK, the spot is protected by a headland. The swell going up the English Channel bends around the headland to hit the beach parallel to it. The spot is 5 miles down wind of the headland, so there is a small cross shore wind blown chop going down the beach. So at much above 20 knots average the chop/swell is very messy and coming from 2 angles.
I've found that wave boards or wavier FSW types are too slow and dont glide through the lulls. A small slalom board is too fast and my brain and skill levels cant keep up. We used to do slalom racing in 2009 and I tried a Fanatic Falcon 80l and 5.6m 3 cam free race sail. Going out I crashed every 100m, coming back in was fine. Everyone else had switched to 4.7m and wave/FSW and racing was canned. I didnt bother with the slalom board there again.
My Exocet Cross 94l is still a bit too fast with a 4.5m for that spot. I've now got a Quatro Tetra 89l for 4.5m sailing, but yet to try it there.
Friends of a similar skill level to me tried stubby FSWs, but found the larger tail width hampered them.
Sometimes I find it easier to head upwind on the way out over the chop, and downwind on the way back in.
To be honest, I dont enjoy maxed out 4.5m sailing at that spot and sometimes go elsewhere.
Hi Orange Whip,
145L board in 20+kn wind seems way too big.
Not sure what your weight is, but in the video you look like max. 180lb.
I weigh around the same, and in 20+kn Wind I start using my 95L Dyno board, or the 105L Fox. But never a 145L Blast which is in my view uncontrollable in such conditions.
It is for sure not the board alone, but also technique.
So, buy a 105L board (Severne Fox highly recommended for chop due to the Vee), put a 5.5 freeride/co-cam freerace sail on it.
Front foot stretched, full body tension, footstraps in outermost position and maybe the mastfoot position a cm back.
That should overall bring your legs in a quite horizontal position, and your body center of gravity quite far on the side of the board.
With your legs being horizontal instead of vertical, they can act much better as suspensionr for the chop. I.e. the movements of the board are not transferred into your body, but absorbed by the legs.
And then, as the others said, go fast, fully committed, and permanently adjust your course to the waves (for the higher ones, bear away and go with the waves. And aim more upwind for where the wave is low.
I just sailed few days ago in 25+kn wind with a 4.7 crossover sail and 95L FSW board. And I am definitely not a good surfer, still learning. Max speed was around 40 km/h. Look at 2:30 minutes in the video.
Select to expand quotemariachi76 said..
That should overall bring your legs in a quite horizontal position, and your body center of gravity quite far on the side of the board.
With your legs being horizontal instead of vertical, they can act much better as suspensionr for the chop. I.e. the movements of the board are not transferred into your body, but absorbed by the legs.
check out this video, thats a perfect example of flying over the fin and on the leeward rail, the body fully horizontal, acting as suspension.
140l Blast is a lot of board in 20 knots and chop. What do you weigh? The blasts are awesome at chop but they don't rail or ride nose up that much. They tend to sit level and flat, but will 'chop top hop' well at speed as opposed to needing to fly like a slalom.
In your video your boom looks very high to me how tall are you? As a result your harness also looks high, so your stance a little off (in my opinion no offence) if you can get that 'perfect 7' going, the board will look after you, but like others have said here it can frustrating getting dialled in, can change from day to day, set up to set up especially full on slalom gear that needs to be driven right with correct fin, mast placement, foot strap placement etc etc .However the blasts are very forgiving as is seen in your gybe letting you stand right over it and get out of trouble.
Seat harness are defiantly easier/better at automatically getting your weight low so you can drive off a fin.
Like others have said one of the best ways to deal with chop is to send it! You will need to adjust your line and yes you will stack now and again but hay you will be grinning from ear to ear!
Select to expand quotemariachi76 said..mariachi76 said..
That should overall bring your legs in a quite horizontal position, and your body center of gravity quite far on the side of the board.
With your legs being horizontal instead of vertical, they can act much better as suspensionr for the chop. I.e. the movements of the board are not transferred into your body, but absorbed by the legs.
check out this video, thats a perfect example of flying over the fin and on the leeward rail, the body fully horizontal, acting as suspension.
best
mariachi76
Great video of someone very comfortable in chop (and over powered) and sending it , look at how much the board and rig bounce around but how little his head does, very skilled rider. However that is a very small 80-90l slalom falcon very different to the 140l blast Orange Whip is on. The blasts just dont really do the rail/tail thing in my opinion. I ride a 130l and a 100l blast both sit flat and tend to loose grip if you try to pressure the leeward rail or ride nose up, but they do grab again readily so a quick bend of the knees and a hook of the heels gets you going again, and they do seem to just eat the chop up with out bucking off the rider, especially if you use a more raked fin not a pointer. The blasts do not go a quick as full on slalom gear, but they do let you ride quick with bad stance, poor position, or technique I know as i do it all the time!!
Sorry I may have confused the issue as I posted a video, not sure Orange Whip has posted a video yet, of me on the Blast 145. I've got the same problem though.
I appreciate the stance advice. I think I have set my harness lines too long, maybe boom too high as well, in the past. I've been working on improving my 7 stance on the fin. Sometimes I get confused when switching between fin and foil as my overall experience is still <2 years total windsurfing.
I'm 6'1 and somewhere around 190-195lbs in that video
Select to expand quotemariachi76 said..
I just sailed few days ago in 25+kn wind with a 4.7 crossover sail and 95L FSW board. And I am definitely not a good surfer, still learning. Max speed was around 40 km/h. Look at 2:30 minutes in the video.
How did you hold the camera in that video?
While I can't see the video generating the same amount of controversy as the legendary "2 feet" did a few years back, the technique has got me puzzled. The horizon doesn't seem to bounce around, but surely nobody can fly a drone well enough to keep that close
Blast just needs a better fin and tailwalking in semi control is attainable.
Stock fins are junk.
Select to expand quoteaeroegnr said..
Sorry I may have confused the issue as I posted a video, not sure Orange Whip has posted a video yet, of me on the Blast 145. I've got the same problem though.
I appreciate the stance advice. I think I have set my harness lines too long, maybe boom too high as well, in the past. I've been working on improving my 7 stance on the fin. Sometimes I get confused when switching between fin and foil as my overall experience is still
I'm 6'1 and somewhere around 190-195lbs in that video
I would not go for a perfect "7" in heavy chop. That slalom rider in the 2nd post is not using a perfect 7 - he is using more bend at hip & knee & longer lines. Perfect 7 is good for lighter winds & efficiency but not for everything IMHO...
Of course, for the price of a new decent fin, you can buy yourself a great used smaller high wind board.
Select to expand quoteLeeD said..
Blast just needs a better fin and tailwalking in semi control is attainable.
Stock fins are junk.
In this case I was on a 43cm select. Stock is a 44cm choco.
If it NEVER spins out, it's easy to tailwalk over 3-5 windswells without control problems.
Select to expand quoteMr Milk said..mariachi76 said..
I just sailed few days ago in 25+kn wind with a 4.7 crossover sail and 95L FSW board. And I am definitely not a good surfer, still learning. Max speed was around 40 km/h. Look at 2:30 minutes in the video.
How did you hold the camera in that video?
While I can't see the video generating the same amount of controversy as the legendary "2 feet" did a few years back, the technique has got me puzzled. The horizon doesn't seem to bounce around, but surely nobody can fly a drone well enough to keep that close
Hi,
it is an insta360 one X2 camera, mounted on a approx 120cm stick on a small harness/belt which I wear over my windsurf harness.
the camera has a stabilization which keeps the horizon perfectly level.
it is clearly the best camera for windsurfing videos. Check out the other videos in my channel ("windsurf Jinshan") where you can even move around yourself with the mouse (or even better when using the YouTube app in your cell phone).
best
mariachi76
Select to expand quoteLeeD said..
Blast just needs a better fin and tailwalking in semi control is attainable.
Stock fins are junk.
"Stock fins are junk."Totally agree
Went out today in similar conditions, I may have a video of it but it's from the front so who knows if I'll be able to tell posture from it. Had a mounting issue.
Anyway, gusty on a 7.5, Blast 145, 43cm select. Was getting overpowered in the gusts and had to pull more outhaul to keep it from being too backhanded.
High boom, lines moved to around 28-30in or so instead of 32 or whatever I had before. HUGE difference in control. I could feel more mast base pressure and could take the load of my arms. Easier to get in the back strap under stress in the swells too because I could keep my weight on the front, just had to time the move.
It's a bit funny because the feeling is totally different from what would freak me out on a race foil setup, where I really want longer lines unless it's really light wind.
I went out in 7.5/overpowered conditions. My technique still needs a little bit more, likely longer lines, and straighter arms. But, this is with my big 11'8" windsup.
It's more comfortable in these conditions than my 145 Blast, but I also picked up a 10+ years old 120L X-Cite Ride for a great price and I'll be trying that in similar conditions as soon as I can. The Link just didn't carve as well for me but I imagine that's more my technique than anything.
