Select to expand quoteFaff said..ARichards said..DWF said..omg said..
Hey folks, what's the deal that DT rates the Slick worse in waves than Unit? Anyone ridden them back to back and could give an opinion?
Thanks!
Both work in waves.
To me, the 24 Unit feels slower, and pulls sideways more. The Slicks feel more slippery, pulling forward, more speed, and handle overpowered better.
Differences are SLIGHT, so better to pick based on boom or handle preference. Many would not notice any difference, other than handle versus boom.
Don't get caught up in chart analysis
Hi DWF
Do you use the aluula or the standard Dacron versions ?
Do you know the weight difference between the Unit 2024 and the new Slick 2024 ? Ive tried to find the weights online but they don't seem to be mentioined anywhere.
Aaron
2024 Unit weights are on the website.
The weight of the new Slicks are not on any website. I've already looked. Yes the weight of the 2024 units are on the website. That's why I was asking DWF, if he knows the weight. As he's been using the new slicks. So I'm sure he knows what the weight of the new slick and the new units are, and which in is lighter between the two.
Aaron
Select to expand quoteARichards said..
The weight of the new Slicks are not on any website. I've already looked. Yes the weight of the 2024 units are on the website. That's why I was asking DWF, if he knows the weight. As he's been using the new slicks. So I'm sure he knows what the weight of the new slick and the new units are, and which in is lighter between the two.
Aaron
In 2023 the physical weights of the Slick and Units were near identical, but the Slick flew lighter. So Slick felt lighter all the time. This difference in feel was designed in. For 2024 some of the tricks used to make the 23 Slick feel lighter, were added to the 24 Unit. So now the Unit and Slick have similar lighter feel when flying.
Also note that for 2024 both Units and Slicks have fewer rub strips on the leading edge seams. Those blue bands sewn on. So everything is slightly lighter for 24.
Don't use physical weight to decide between buying Slick or Unit for season 24.
Select to expand quoteDWF said..
Don't use physical weight to decide between buying Slick or Unit for season 24.
OK - and if its boom vs handles...I'm not finding the diameter of the handles on the Units (vs Slick)...thanks!
Select to expand quoteSpokeyDoke said..DWF said..
Don't use physical weight to decide between buying Slick or Unit for season 24.
OK - and if its boom vs handles...I'm not finding the diameter of the handles on the Units (vs Slick)...thanks!
That's because the handles are slightly oval and the boom is round. The SLS boom is close to the feel of the handle. A slight edge goes to the handle because of it being oval. Less fatigue.
The aluminum boom and standard carbon boom will be more forearm fatigue from the larger grip size. Always buy the SLS boom for its smaller grip size.
When you get to spend lots of hours riding the handles versus the boom, other differences (not grip) become more of a thing. The handles being on two different planes for example. Designed to reduce wrist twist discomfort/fatigue. But then, with the boom being on one plane, hand shifts while riding become more automatic feeling, and instinctive. You can shift hands anywhere, quicker, and blind! Doing even simple tricks, like tacks and jibes, hitting the booms with your hands can be done blind. With the handles, you might miss. Booms are the hot new thing with pros in competitions for a reason. You never miss with your hands.
Booms are going into production with nearly every brand for 24 and 25. The hand writing is on the wall.
Select to expand quoteDWF said..SpokeyDoke said..DWF said..
Don't use physical weight to decide between buying Slick or Unit for season 24.
OK - and if its boom vs handles...I'm not finding the diameter of the handles on the Units (vs Slick)...
Booms are going into production with nearly every brand for 24 and 25. The hand writing is on the wall.
Finally the pro's are realising how good the boom is, I agree with all your points. Post that comment under its own thread title and you will be jumped on. We even have some at our local who swear soft handles are better.
You did forget the point of adding harness lines, if wanted, is so easy with a boom.
Select to expand quoteairsail said..
Finally the pro's are realising how good the boom is, I agree with all your points. Post that comment under its own thread title and you will be jumped on. We even have some at our local who swear soft handles are better.
You did forget the point of adding harness lines, if wanted, is so easy with a boom.
Yes, even at our local beach, most riders now prefer the boom. Duotone was ridiculed for doing the boom only. They were right all along.
Also note that Duotone is the only boom with zero sideways flex. Without standoff arms, their boom is the most rigid of all brands.
What do you think of Slick dlab 2024 vs Unit Dlab 2024 in navigation? Which one will have better upwind angles and performance? Are spam and weight the same?
I like to sail at full capacity with the mikeslab foil and harness but also get into the waves...
thank you
Select to expand quoteUrsus said..
What do you think of Slick dlab 2024 vs Unit Dlab 2024 in navigation? Which one will have better upwind angles and performance? Are spam and weight the same?
I like to sail at full capacity with the mikeslab foil and harness but also get into the waves...
thank you
I stopped buying D/Labs. Went all Dacron this year.
The same differences apply between Unit's and Slicks, Aluula and Dacron.
I'd pick D/lab Slick for that.
Select to expand quoteDWF said..airsail said..
Finally the pro's are realising how good the boom is, I agree with all your points. Post that comment under its own thread title and you will be jumped on. We even have some at our local who swear soft handles are better.
You did forget the point of adding harness lines, if wanted, is so easy with a boom.
Yes, even at our local beach, most riders now prefer the boom. Duotone was ridiculed for doing the boom only. They were right all along.
Also note that Duotone is the only boom with zero sideways flex. Without standoff arms, their boom is the most rigid of all brands.
I haven't used other booms, but when I tried other wings with handles, I realised the genius of the Duotone boom system (which I had considered amateurish until then). This is also reflected in the weights. 2023 slicks with a carbon boom weighed less than 2024 units.
I think the only downside is that the central strut needs to be bent to create the space. I've noticed that a lot of other premium wings have basically straight struts nowdays.
Select to expand quoteFaff said..DWF said..airsail said..
Finally the pro's are realising how good the boom is, I agree with all your points. Post that comment under its own thread title and you will be jumped on. We even have some at our local who swear soft handles are better.
You did forget the point of adding harness lines, if wanted, is so easy with a boom.
Yes, even at our local beach, most riders now prefer the boom. Duotone was ridiculed for doing the boom only. They were right all along.
Also note that Duotone is the only boom with zero sideways flex. Without standoff arms, their boom is the most rigid of all brands.
I haven't used other booms, but when I tried other wings with handles, I realised the genius of the Duotone boom system (which I had considered amateurish until then). This is also reflected in the weights. 2023 slicks with a carbon boom weighed less than 2024 units.
I think the only downside is that the central strut needs to be bent to create the space. I've noticed that a lot of other premium wings have basically straight struts nowdays.
The rest of the brands have booms stuck on a normal strut where as the slick strut is designed around the boom. you'll notice less infill needed and also a thinner strut compared to all other brands boom wings
Select to expand quoteleepasty said..Faff said..DWF said..airsail said..
Finally the pro's are realising how good the boom is, I agree with all your points. Post that comment under its own thread title and you will be jumped on. We even have some at our local who swear soft handles are better.
You did forget the point of adding harness lines, if wanted, is so easy with a boom.
Yes, even at our local beach, most riders now prefer the boom. Duotone was ridiculed for doing the boom only. They were right all along.
Also note that Duotone is the only boom with zero sideways flex. Without standoff arms, their boom is the most rigid of all brands.
I haven't used other booms, but when I tried other wings with handles, I realised the genius of the Duotone boom system (which I had considered amateurish until then). This is also reflected in the weights. 2023 slicks with a carbon boom weighed less than 2024 units.
I think the only downside is that the central strut needs to be bent to create the space. I've noticed that a lot of other premium wings have basically straight struts nowdays.
The rest of the brands have booms stuck on a normal strut where as the slick strut is designed around the boom. you'll notice less infill needed and also a thinner strut compared to all other brands boom wings
Some bold statements thinking about all the boom wings out there.
Pretty sure Gongs Aramid Neutra has smaller struts. The Droid and Pulse are pretty small too. I also wouldn't be surprised if the Gong boom Aramid wings are stiffer.
I wish I could compare my Dlab Slick to the Aramid Droid but my problem is I'm one of those strange guys who like Windows especially in light wind.
Select to expand quoteBullroarerTook said..
That baby barf yellow though.
Surprised they didn't use the new white Aluula areis materials
Select to expand quoteBullroarerTook said..
That baby barf yellow though.
Surprised they didn't use the new white Aluula aeris materials
Lots of interesting comments. One thing I know I want is the max forward hand position on the boom as close to the leading edge as possible. Whether I'm flagging on the boom or doing some maneuver, I don't like being limited to a front grab position that's farther back from the leading edge. I have my front hand jammed up at forward most boom position on my SLS Slicks all the time going through certain transitions (like a regrab from behind-the-back tacks/jibes) or just depowering. FWIW, Tucker at Mac Kites also mentioned something similar during some of his Slick reviews
Another question I have is how those "stand off" booms (Droid, Halo, etc) will behave during backwinded riding/transitions. My gut feel tells me they won't be quite as happy, but to be fair I've never tried them. I'm doing more backwinded stuff these days. All the promotional videos of these wings are sponsored kiddies wave flagging and serious jumping (I guess strapless freestyle stuff isn't worthy of a wing promo video)
Hard to tell but it looks like the new Slicks have a wee bit more dihedral than much of the competition. Something to consider if front handle flagging is a higher priority over tacking ease. Reviews needed to verify that.
So I just got a 4.5 and it was folded in thirds from the factory. Not tight in the bag but fairly snug. Pumped it up to make sure there were no leaks and then tried to get it back in the bag. Folding in half won't get it done. Seriously Duotone? I'm replacing OG Units which were a royal pain to get in the bag but at least it wasn't origami.
Select to expand quoteBullroarerTook said..
So I just got a 4.5 and it was folded in thirds from the factory. Not tight in the bag but fairly snug. Pumped it up to make sure there were no leaks and then tried to get it back in the bag. Folding in half won't get it done. Seriously Duotone? I'm replacing OG Units which were a royal pain to get in the bag but at least it wasn't origami.
??
Let us know how it rides!
Select to expand quoteBullroarerTook said..
So I just got a 4.5 and it was folded in thirds from the factory. Not tight in the bag but fairly snug. Pumped it up to make sure there were no leaks and then tried to get it back in the bag. Folding in half won't get it done. Seriously Duotone? I'm replacing OG Units which were a royal pain to get in the bag but at least it wasn't origami.
Slick SLS folds fine in thirds. I don't see how the new one would be different. (OG slicks had these tube bags which were a real pain.)
Select to expand quoteBullroarerTook said..
So I just got a 4.5 and it was folded in thirds from the factory. Not tight in the bag but fairly snug. Pumped it up to make sure there were no leaks and then tried to get it back in the bag. Folding in half won't get it done. Seriously Duotone? I'm replacing OG Units which were a royal pain to get in the bag but at least it wasn't origami.
I got 4.0 and have zero problems to put in the bag. Yes, I fold it in thirds like SLS. It's actually very loose in the bag, they could make bag smaller.
Select to expand quotestrekke said..BullroarerTook said..
So I just got a 4.5 and it was folded in thirds from the factory. Not tight in the bag but fairly snug. Pumped it up to make sure there were no leaks and then tried to get it back in the bag. Folding in half won't get it done. Seriously Duotone? I'm replacing OG Units which were a royal pain to get in the bag but at least it wasn't origami.
??
Let us know how it rides!
Sure, but my reference is the Gen 1 Unit so I'm sure this will be much better in every respect. (Every wing would probably.)
Select to expand quotemotogon said..BullroarerTook said..
So I just got a 4.5 and it was folded in thirds from the factory. Not tight in the bag but fairly snug. Pumped it up to make sure there were no leaks and then tried to get it back in the bag. Folding in half won't get it done. Seriously Duotone? I'm replacing OG Units which were a royal pain to get in the bag but at least it wasn't origami.
I got 4.0 and have zero problems to put in the bag. Yes, I fold it in thirds like SLS. It's actually very loose in the bag, they could make bag smaller.
How does it compare to the SLS?
Select to expand quoteDspace said..
Lots of interesting comments. One thing I know I want is the max forward hand position on the boom as close to the leading edge as possible. Whether I'm flagging on the boom or doing some maneuver, I don't like being limited to a front grab position that's farther back from the leading edge. I have my front hand jammed up at forward most boom position on my SLS Slicks all the time going through certain transitions (like a regrab from behind-the-back tacks/jibes) or just depowering. FWIW, Tucker at Mac Kites also mentioned something similar during some of his Slick reviews
Another question I have is how those "stand off" booms (Droid, Halo, etc) will behave during backwinded riding/transitions. My gut feel tells me they won't be quite as happy, but to be fair I've never tried them. I'm doing more backwinded stuff these days. All the promotional videos of these wings are sponsored kiddies wave flagging and serious jumping (I guess strapless freestyle stuff isn't worthy of a wing promo video)
Hard to tell but it looks like the new Slicks have a wee bit more dihedral than much of the competition. Something to consider if front handle flagging is a higher priority over tacking ease. Reviews needed to verify that.
I don't know about the max forward hand position part, but I suspect your backwinding trick would suffer with the longer stand offs. I would think most other tricks would benefit if the boom is further away, little more stable, but I'm just guessing. I think Gong had different length stand offs available at one point, so I'm sure they have experimented with the stand off lengths and since their team does so well in the trick competitions... I heard Ken W mentioned in one of his interviews that their are pros and cons on that, but did not elaborate.
Select to expand quoteFaff said..motogon said..BullroarerTook said..
So I just got a 4.5 and it was folded in thirds from the factory. Not tight in the bag but fairly snug. Pumped it up to make sure there were no leaks and then tried to get it back in the bag. Folding in half won't get it done. Seriously Duotone? I'm replacing OG Units which were a royal pain to get in the bag but at least it wasn't origami.
I got 4.0 and have zero problems to put in the bag. Yes, I fold it in thirds like SLS. It's actually very loose in the bag, they could make bag smaller.
How does it compare to the SLS?
Definitely better low end. About same upper range.
Gleiten.tv has their review out on their website and YouTube for the 2024 Slick.
gleiten.tv/
My German is a bit rusty but: stiffer canopy and overall small improvements in terms of performance compared to last model: slightly quicker and better upwind (marginal increase), and more stable when flagged out on waves (as seen in the riding footage, looks pretty well behaved), closing the gap in difference with the current Unit. It feels extremely light in the air. The only thing that's not good is the flagging out handle: too small, too flexy, which is a shame if true because that would have been an easy fix for Duotone to address... Regardless, they seem to really like it and classify it as a great, super user friendly all rounder that is definitely one of their favorite wings so far. Sounds promising, looking forward to getting more real world feedback.
Select to expand quotestrekke said..
Gleiten.tv has their review out on their website and YouTube for the 2024 Slick.
gleiten.tv/
My German is a bit rusty but: stiffer canopy and overall small improvements in terms of performance compared to last model: slightly quicker and better upwind (marginal increase), and more stable when flagged out on waves (as seen in the riding footage, looks pretty well behaved), closing the gap in difference with the current Unit. It feels extremely light in the air. The only thing that's not good is the flagging out handle: too small, too flexy, which is a shame if true because that would have been an easy fix for Duotone to address... Regardless, they seem to really like it and classify it as a great, super user friendly all rounder that is definitely one of their favorite wings so far. Sounds promising, looking forward to getting more real world feedback.
english subtitles available !
Select to expand quotestrekke said..
Gleiten.tv has their review out on their website and YouTube for the 2024 Slick.
gleiten.tv/
My German is a bit rusty but: stiffer canopy and overall small improvements in terms of performance compared to last model: slightly quicker and better upwind (marginal increase), and more stable when flagged out on waves (as seen in the riding footage, looks pretty well behaved), closing the gap in difference with the current Unit. It feels extremely light in the air. The only thing that's not good is the flagging out handle: too small, too flexy, which is a shame if true because that would have been an easy fix for Duotone to address... Regardless, they seem to really like it and classify it as a great, super user friendly all rounder that is definitely one of their favorite wings so far. Sounds promising, looking forward to getting more real world feedback.
I'm a very longtime NKB and current Duotone user both on kites and wings BUT I still cannot get my head around why the f... DT cannot change the stupid outflow valve in their wings to good valves the other manufacturers are using. I was in 0C weather and 1-2C water for a couple of hours and what I end of the session want is to quicky pack things up but no, I need to release all the air through this pretty stupid airport valve as the outlet valve is so stiff that it doesn't open easily - I have torn this from one of my wing so I won't be trying to use it anymore.
The other brainfart is the front flag handle - since their first wing, people have been whining about it - any improvements? Not really, WHY?!?!?
These two things are really annoying and so easily corrected, but DT is not doing anything about them?!?!
Select to expand quoteFoilColorado said..
Hey does anyone have a Duotone adapter?!?
I bought spares and have them scattered around my stuff because it will be necessary.
