Yes 36 too much. Tail and board width offer plenty of support, and you'll be more centered than a freeride board.
You bounce back between a pure freeride board, pure freestyle board, and a pure waveboard. and now you talk about putting a 36cm fin on the pure freestyle which is a sure recipe for failure imo. My take is you are not knowing exactly what you want, and I don't mean it to troll you or anything but I think you really should try each type of board you are considering before spending your hard earned cash. One type of board is bound to suit you more than the others, so it's worth experimenting before commiting . But as others have mentionned I really think you should also look at a big freewave board, because they are the type of do it all boards that usually suit the most styles of sailing and type of sailors. A pure freestyle is definitely way too limited in its range.
Select to expand quoteAl1 said..
You bounce back between a pure freeride board, pure freestyle board, and a pure waveboard. and now you talk about putting a 36cm fin on the pure freestyle which is a sure recipe for failure imo. My take is you are not knowing exactly what you want, and I don't mean it to troll you or anything but I think you really should try each type of board you are considering before spending your hard earned cash. One type of board is bound to suit you more than the others, so it's worth experimenting before commiting . But as others have mentionned I really think you should also look at a big freewave board, because they are the type of do it all boards that usually suit the most styles of sailing and type of sailors. A pure freestyle is definitely way too limited in its range.
That's exactly what I'm doing!
The thing is that at the time I opened this thread I had around 7kg less...
The retailer said Skate 108L is a slow board and advised me not to buy.
It's either that or Rocket 115L because it has the back straps almost in the middle.
Here's the thing with me. Would buy a freerace board 115L or 120L something like Patrik F race 120 would be great but I have troubles with the back foot getting in the strap if those are on the side. So with 108 skate I'd jump in straps in seconds.
Of course I try to fix that but I've been wsurfing for 14 years and 4 straps are killing me and I don't know why.
The skate 108 would be a bit small for my 95kg but what attracts me is the sensation which is like slalom but with 3 straps.
Until I decide I will use my manta 98L which is now a sinker. Will keep on practicing the back strap on that.
The sails are 4.2 5.0 and 6.7 and 5.5 race.
Skate has slalom rocker.
But freestyle or wave setup of straps and base.
Quick, but never as fast, top end, as slalom board and with good rider.
I'd suggest bigger Magic Ride.
Agree with Al1 that it looks like you don't know what you are looking for. Also strange that after 14 years of windsurfing you can get bedazzled by some reseller, considering windsurfing gear choice is so personal because of so many variables involved.
I personally, never wanted a freeride board which can definitely be a bit faster and better in chop over long distance than a freestyle board. But IMHO freestyle board has more to offer plus it will always be shorter and lighter.
I remember I gave my freestyle setup to a friend a few times who is somewhat older guy in his late 60s and he was amazed at how lighter everything felt. And I said, - yes I'm a lazy guy. But it makes things so much more fun and easier ..
Ok, I'll bite on the assumption the question is genuine. In my view, the right answers have been posted. That is, unless you actually do freestyle, don't get a dedicated freestyle board. You will be compromising your range of use. By trying to make it something it wasn't designed for, you're taking a big risk. The odd non freestyler who claims the board is better is either a rare exception and/or blessed with super flat water. A person that uses the board for freestyle has above average skill so not a guide for a non freestyler (in my opinion). Board makers describe their different gear really well. Match that with what you're looking for. I know it's hard when time is limited and you can't demo the different options in your local conditions. Best of luck!
The MR really is plug and play. It planes quickly and carves like it's a razor blade, due to paper thin back rails. I always tell people if you can't jibe a MR, you can't jibe yet. The smaller sizes even work great in smaller waves. That said, any FS board will be the antithesis of boards like the MR or RRD Fireride. The rails, rocker, shape are 180 out from each other. So the question is what do you want to do?
Yes it sux i cant travel atm so i could try. But Im still 90% decided for skate 108.
Loreni. Let us know what you get and think after riding. Good advice here indeed. I thought about it and yes, most people I know have freeride boards. Some have freestyle. I think that if and once you like your freestyle, you will not look back. I have 100 and 106 and sailed and jumped both in some crazy conditions and love electric ride. Also chop is a chop. In bigger organized waves my freestyles cut like butter, however there is chop at one spot here that goes perpendicular to the board with1-2 foot bumps. I think no board can handle it well and you can dig the nose very easy. Also as one guy mentioned here Freestyle boards are quick but not fast (good saying). I can probably match many intermediate racers for very short distance but then it becomes uncomfortable. It's also about your riding style. My style is grooveride slow then accelerate fast when I see a wave/bump and jump then repeat. Most people I know don't ride lime this.. :)
Select to expand quoteLoreni said..
The skate 108 would be a bit small for my 95kg but what attracts me is the sensation which is like slalom but with 3 straps.
Until I decide I will use my manta 98L which is now a sinker. Will keep on practicing the back strap on that.
The sails are 4.2 5.0 and 6.7 and 5.5 race.
A Freestyle board is NOT a slalom sensation with 3 straps....like...at all. Not even close.Race sails on Freestyle boards freaking suck (at least my experience) because the trim of the board is really centered and far forward.
However a race sail demands a locked-in, super-7 kind of stance.On the skate, you will likely notice that you overstretch your front foot and burn your back leg trying to drive the power of the race sail into speed.
A lot of people claim, that they are so fast with their freestyle machines but when i'm at the beach looking on the water, they are some of the slowest on the water because yes the rocker line is slalom based but due to the centred and upright stance + very thick tail, freestyle boards bounce on every damn chop. These boards are not made to fly over the chop off the fin at all.Starboard markets their Ignite with outboard straps as a beginner-friendly freeride alternative for people who want to get into freestyle...well German SURF magazine has tested that and confirmes that it freaking sucks at freeride even with outboard straps.
I highly recommend to try before you buy. Some people freeride their skates because they like the loose feel. But they are not fast doing it (usually)
Honestly from what you describe a 100-110l Freewave would be a MUCH better choice (Kode and 3S classic are great for vulcans and Flakas, too)
Select to expand quoteLeeD said..
Except fsw has tail rocker, slowing early planing and acceleration.
oh please...that depends a lot on the brand.Y25 RRD, some years of Kode, JP and 3s classic have basically zero tail rocker. The new fanatic also maybe 3mm
hmhm I see.
I found another board. I enjoyed 78L wave board for freeride a lot when I had 78kg now I see JP Magic Wave 115L as some sort of a freemove board. It says it's freestyle in bigger sizes. What about that one?
Then there's the Kode 115L which has 3 straps as well. And skate =)
For some serious speed I'll still have Manta 98L but it's now a sinker heh.
Select to expand quoteLoreni said..
hmhm I see.
I found another board. I enjoyed 78L wave board for freeride a lot when I had 78kg now I see JP Magic Wave 115L as some sort of a freemove board. It says it's freestyle in bigger sizes. What about that one?
Then there's the Kode 115L which has 3 straps as well. And skate =)
For some serious speed I'll still have Manta 98L but it's now a sinker heh.
Is it possible for you to compare the 3?
Either way the Kode 115 would be right up your ally, i reckon. It's a more "eggy" FSW shape with enough width to get into spocks and stuff.
If you can test all 3 my prediction is that you will like the Kode 115 the most, followed by the Skate and then the magic wave.
i've never tried a big "pure" wave board but i think you'll suffer similar issues as i have described earlier. The trim will just be way off with your race sails. Only that instead of a bouncy ride, you'll have a very planted and "boring" straight line sensation...after all it's still a wave board). However if you liked your old waveboard for freeride, there is a good chance that you'll enjoy the magic wave. I just wouldnt personally go for that
I only have 1 race sail 5.5 vapor. Looking forward to only use no cam sails....ease my windsurfing.
Mostly no cam sails: 4.2 atlas 5.0 poison 6.7 hellcat
The thing that turned me away from magic ride is why are they so damn wide. Could go with 109 but it's so wide. For instance fanatic has Blast 130L with same width as Magic ride 109...70cm.
Width gives tons of stability for slogging, and much more early planing and planing thru jibes. MRide tails are narrow with thin rails for jibing at medium high speeds.
Super Ride for steadier, higher winds.
Select to expand quoteLoreni said..
hmhm I see.
I found another board. I enjoyed 78L wave board for freeride a lot when I had 78kg now I see JP Magic Wave 115L as some sort of a freemove board. It says it's freestyle in bigger sizes. What about that one?
Then there's the Kode 115L which has 3 straps as well. And skate =)
For some serious speed I'll still have Manta 98L but it's now a sinker heh.
Maybe the answer is not a bigger board, but a lighter you?
I have no wheat products diet and works great. But Im pretty sure I wont get below 90kg.
Loreni. I wonder how bad you care about plaining gybes? (at the expense of 70x240+) and probability this thing will start walking on the fin and bounce around when wind pics up.
Personally I always care about making gybes almost as tight as tacks not to loose any upwind and do them as fast as possible. I also thought that making board wider makes gybes more technical and also if you make a wide board with a pin tail makes a board run slower. I had Excite ride 120 (maybe it got renamed to Magic now) when I was intermediate. And had very exciting ride, learned to jump and do a couple of tricks when I sold it and bought Tabou 3S 96. Lol
We have a local guy who weighs about 140-150 pounds and uses Excite 135 in super light wind with 8m sail but as soon as the wind picks up a bit he cannot cope with it.
What I really like about current freestyle boards is how short and nimble they are and also foil powerbox and with the foil you can outplaine anyone with any race sail size and any board in light wind so why even bother buying wider race/freeride boards and look like you carry furniture to the beach all the time. Lol
Cheers mate. These are my thoughts, not bashing anyone.
Hi guys just want to make a small update to my topic here:
So i figured that 108L board is a bit too small for all in one board. A 99kg guy here from Slovenia (3kg more than me) has 108L freestyle board for high wind sailing 4.0
So all in one board for me should definitely be 115L. I then figured I have 3 choices:
-Flikka custom 115L freestyle board - have him do it for me
-Tabou 3S 116 (because it's more freeride oriented)
-Tabout Manta 116L - to continue studying the mystery of slalom boards
These are the choices and even before I buy I have to get my knee check it feels like damaged and in need of surgery.
That's it. It's not gonna be skate 108 or magic ride for sure.
I see Robby Naish sailing his slalom board without cambers so I think needing a cambered sails for slalom is a myth.
Another thing I never experienced in 14 years of windsurfing is freestyle sail. How are those compared to lets say Neil pryde combat?
I'm 92kg and the 109 skate got waaaay too big with anything smaller than a 5.0m unless you have access to dead flat water. A ~100L would be a much better option.
Select to expand quoteLoreni said..
-Flikka custom - have him do it for me
Seems to be the obvious choise in my opinion, i would have visited him and discuss about it if i were you.
I think you should decide the liters depending on your prefered sail range, i am sure he would know what to do after discussing with you.
Select to expand quoteLoreni said..
I only have 1 race sail 5.5 vapor. Looking forward to only use no cam sails....ease my windsurfing.
Mostly no cam sails: 4.2 atlas 5.0 poison 6.7 hellcat
The thing that turned me away from magic ride is why are they so damn wide. Could go with 109 but it's so wide. For instance fanatic has Blast 130L with same width as Magic ride 109...
Select to expand quoteJP Magic ride is designed more for beginner short boarders, width makes it easier to sail, planes easier and is less technical.
Jp Super Ride is narrower but a bit more technical. It might be a good option for you.
I have one. I foil it, windsurf it, love it.
Select to expand quoteLoreni said..
Another thing I never experienced in 14 years of windsurfing is freestyle sail. How are those compared to lets say Neil pryde combat?
A freestyle sail is like a freestyle board - designed specific for freestyle. Having said that, I think a freestyle sail is a bit more broad in it's use than a freestyle board. There is massive low end power (sail size smaller) with the forces high on the sail (for popping on flat water). However, it becomes unstable at the upper end of the wind range. They are very light. So not as durable (thinner materials) vs a regular sail. Aside from my moderate freestyle, I've used my freestyle sail for foiling when wind is steady (not going near the overpowered state). Great low end pumping then extremely light when on the foil. Never used it for other sailing versions.
72 kg.
Had 110 Skate for 3 seasons now. Mostly 4.5-5.2 sails, wind in the 15-22 range. Works great when the foil is overpowered, a step down.
Freestyle strap setup, but mostly 30 cm fin, mast base just forward of center. Jibes great, smooth when flying the fin.
Slalom rocker is quick and fast, freestyle strap placement is quick but kinda slow, compared to outboard.
Select to expand quoteLoonie said..Loreni said..
Another thing I never experienced in 14 years of windsurfing is freestyle sail. How are those compared to lets say Neil pryde combat?
A freestyle sail is like a freestyle board - designed specific for freestyle. Having said that, I think a freestyle sail is a bit more broad in it's use than a freestyle board. There is massive low end power (sail size smaller) with the forces high on the sail (for popping on flat water). However, it becomes unstable at the upper end of the wind range. They are very light. So not as durable (thinner materials) vs a regular sail. Aside from my moderate freestyle, I've used my freestyle sail for foiling when wind is steady (not going near the overpowered state). Great low end pumping then extremely light when on the foil. Never used it for other sailing versions.
Depends on the freestyle sail. Some are more "freewavy" than others and can be tuned for more wind with more downhaul.
Almost all "freestyle" sails can be tuned normal for good power AND ovedownhauled to flutter and release wind. Just add more downhaul.
But strong downhaul is not always the call for foiling, as changing down is better.
Just like any other sail, but in smaller sizes.
