Forums > Windsurfing   Gps and Speed talk

50 knots?

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Created by yoyo > 9 months ago, 20 Nov 2008
Mobydisc
NSW, 9029 posts
22 Nov 2008 8:13PM
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Spacemonkey! said...

You could come up with a stupid reason to exclude windsurfers too. In the end it is just stupid terminology. If it is wind powered, it is sailing IMO. However I will never say I'm going out for a sail, unless I am taking the piss. It all boils down to them not being happy that kiters reach 50 knots first.


By any measure windsurfing is sailing. Of course you are not sitting down, holding onto a tiller and pulling on ropes. However all those bits and pieces in yachts and dingies doesn't make them sailing.

Its exactly the same with hangliding vs paragliding (not sure what they are called). A hanglider is flying when it soars around. Paragliders just sort of float around and are not flying. You would never say a parachute is flying.

Standing on a tiny board in 5cms of water with a kite 20 meters away from you, attached by strings is not sailing. Kiteboarding has more in common with wakeboarding than sailing, except the power source is the wind, not a motor.



Windhogger
SA, 88 posts
22 Nov 2008 10:18PM
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The Kite/board setup performs basicly the same as any other sailing craft eg. it uses lateral resistance to point upwind, and can do all the other points of sailing, also gybing and tacking etc. Just happens that now and again we get more altitude and speed than most other sailing craft can

PS. Catman hit a peak speed of 60+ knots at Luderitz

sausage
QLD, 4873 posts
22 Nov 2008 10:14PM
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Mobydisc said...

You would never say a parachute is flying.




Moby,
I like your thinking.........
therefore

Kiting is like skydiving in reverse but done horizontally.

Gestalt
QLD, 14627 posts
22 Nov 2008 10:16PM
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Windhogger said...

The Kite/board setup performs basicly the same as any other sailing craft eg. it uses lateral resistance to point upwind, and can do all the other points of sailing, also gybing and tacking etc. Just happens that now and again we get more altitude and speed than most other sailing craft can

PS. Catman hit a peak speed of 60+ knots at Luderitz


if that's the case mate it should be easy for most kiters to figure out port/starboard rules then.


i'm bored.

Windhogger
SA, 88 posts
22 Nov 2008 11:24PM
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Gestalt said...

Windhogger said...

The Kite/board setup performs basicly the same as any other sailing craft eg. it uses lateral resistance to point upwind, and can do all the other points of sailing, also gybing and tacking etc. Just happens that now and again we get more altitude and speed than most other sailing craft can

PS. Catman hit a peak speed of 60+ knots at Luderitz


if that's the case mate it should be easy for most kiters to figure out port/starboard rules then.


i'm bored.


I agree, and more so with the newer kites having better control, we have no excuses

I'm bored too.

jamez
9 posts
22 Nov 2008 10:06PM
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out with the old, in with the new i say. time to step up and put the iron boards in the cupboard and buy a kite guys.

Windhogger
SA, 88 posts
23 Nov 2008 12:09AM
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jamez said...

out with the old, in with the new i say. time to step up and put the iron boards in the cupboard and buy a kite guys.


Hey jamez thats hitting below the belt..... I'm ducking for cover!

greenleader
QLD, 5283 posts
22 Nov 2008 11:59PM
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lets look at known quantities here.

at speed trials for the last few decades a lot of craft have reached their limits no matter how much time money and effort is thrown at them.

windsurfers blew the doors off conventional thinking about sailing speed in the eighties and continue to inch forward knot by knot.

kites have just entered this race.....did i mention doors!

i consider kites to be every bit as legit as windsurfers and the guys achieving 50 knots are trained athletes.

pulled along by a parachute!!!!!! "far cough"

break the classes into "masts with stays", "masts without stays", "free for all"

and the biggy " fastest wind powered man on water"

Gestalt
QLD, 14627 posts
23 Nov 2008 12:25AM
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this is the fastest sail speed record i believe.

www.nalsa.org/speed_record.htm

vando
QLD, 3418 posts
23 Nov 2008 12:33AM
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Gestalt said...

this is the fastest sail speed record i believe.

www.nalsa.org/speed_record.htm




On a lake too

Genetrix
SA, 236 posts
23 Nov 2008 9:52AM
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I wonder how Finians kite lessons are going

Dr Speed
68 posts
23 Nov 2008 5:05PM
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below the pic which led the ISAF to their decision



shallow water board [}:)]

dism
NSW, 660 posts
23 Nov 2008 7:19PM
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Gestalt said...

this is the fastest sail speed record i believe.

www.nalsa.org/speed_record.htm




Whoa. 100knots and field assembly mentioned as 'duct tape' try that for your kites then, haha


Dr. Speed, that picture means nothing to us over here.

When I first looked at it the image on the right looked like a racing car tyre

What are you trying to explain with it? It has no freeboard indications, dimensions, etc, what are you talking about?

Spit it out now son

Dr Speed
68 posts
23 Nov 2008 7:46PM
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I think, for the ISAF the racing car tyre on the kiteboard was the ultimate proof that kiteboarding is not sailing

NotWal
QLD, 7430 posts
23 Nov 2008 9:10PM
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Dr Speed said...

I think, for the ISAF the racing car tyre on the kiteboard was the ultimate proof that kiteboarding is not sailing


Umm... don't think so.

westhammer
WA, 506 posts
23 Nov 2008 11:33PM
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Excuse me if i am wrong,,but surly any wind driven craft on water has to be a contender, be it any contraption,anyone who has the blks to want to be the fastest free energy Straight line Sailor has to be reconised.Fk all the big wig snobbery involved and lets see how fast we are in ten more years

Dr Speed
68 posts
24 Nov 2008 5:58AM
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kiters are the sailors nightmare[}:)]:

choco
SA, 4175 posts
24 Nov 2008 9:18AM
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Dr Speed

How short could you have kite lines?

elmo
WA, 8868 posts
24 Nov 2008 8:14AM
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Dr Speed said...

kiters are the sailors nightmare[}:)]:



only the dickheads


All the rest are good crew

pepe47
WA, 1382 posts
24 Nov 2008 8:44AM
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jamez said...

out with the old, in with the new i say. time to step up and put the iron boards in the cupboard and buy a kite guys.


Yeah, c'mon everyone. Get outta that closet....

AUS1111
WA, 3621 posts
24 Nov 2008 4:10PM
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As windsurfer, I am as keen as anyone for a windsurfer to hold the record, however I have seen no sensible argument so far as to why kites do not now hold the record.

It's a joke.

yoyo
WA, 1646 posts
24 Nov 2008 6:01PM
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10 February 2005, 7:11 pm
Three-Day Meeting Concludes

ISAF Executive Committee Meeting
Chantilly, France

Three days of meetings in Chantilly, France concluded on Tuesday 8 February

.... in considering recognition of kite surfing within the speed sailing arena, significant safety concerns continued to be expressed. At this stage, ISAF does not give endorsement to recognizing kite powered crafts as holders of the outright World Sailing Speed Record
.

Safety Concerns???

I thought falling at speed with a kite was far less dangerous than catapults on a windsurfer or a multihull.

I haven't been able to find any other reason put forward by the ISAF executive committee

CJW
NSW, 1726 posts
24 Nov 2008 9:09PM
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As a windsurfer I also would love for someone from our sport to hold the outright world sailing speed record, but as far as i'm concerned that's no longer the case and in my opinion we will never again hold the record.

Lets be realistic this is the 'outright world record' It's not the 'fastest windsurfer' record. The number of radical contraptions that have had a crack at the record over time is staggering. Look at Yellow Pages, it's basically a wing on it's end sitting atop of what can hardly be considered a function sailing craft as we know one. It can only sail in one direction, only sail at particular angles of attack and apart from a couple of locations in the world is utterly useless. At least anyone can go down to the kite shop, grab a kite and a board (ok maybe modify the board) and have a crack at the world speed record.

It's the world speed sailing record, as far as i'm concerned almost anything goes, a kite is hardly bordering on the radical.

Genetrix
SA, 236 posts
24 Nov 2008 10:38PM
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well said, Kiteboarding is the future of speed sailing.

greenleader
QLD, 5283 posts
24 Nov 2008 10:25PM
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i think the asaf is grasping at strings!

sausage
QLD, 4873 posts
24 Nov 2008 10:51PM
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Dr Speed said...

kiters are the sailors nightmare[}:)]:




WTF was that video about Dr? Too much speed (or is that liquid ice) can fry your brain?

elmo
WA, 8868 posts
24 Nov 2008 10:08PM
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Dr Speed said...

kiters are the sailors nightmare[}:)]:




I've seen that dickhead before, he doesn't know whether he is coming or going

hardie
WA, 4129 posts
24 Nov 2008 10:12PM
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elmo said...

Dr Speed said...

kiters are the sailors nightmare[}:)]:




I've seen that dickhead before, he doesn't know whether he is coming or going


I think looking at the lighting, that daylight savings could be the culprit here?

jaymac
WA, 44 posts
27 Nov 2008 12:24PM
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The amazing thing about the recent run of kite records is that they are being achieved on standard seaworthy equipment. The inflated leading edge and floppy aspect plan really distorts in apparent winds over 50kts and a finite limit will be reached. All sailors have to applaud the achievement
When kite design gets extreme (like some sailboats have) with a carbon fibre leading edge foil, and a dozen fully formed carbon battens, even a solid foil perhaps, then perhaps 100 kts is the potential. But it won't be sailing!
It will be very expensive after a crash and will not be self launching from the water. A really dangerous machine to fly, at this time the ISAF might have reason to withdraw their recognition.
Congratulations to the 50kt heros.

club309
QLD, 66 posts
1 Dec 2008 12:13PM
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is it true that the ISAF won't allow kite records based on safety concerns?. that is flaming ridiculous!!!! so many other types of speed record are so much more dangerous than kite boarding. I mean how many people have died breaking the 500m speed sailing record compared to how many have died chasing land speed records etc.

ISAF have become the governing body for kite boarding i believe, but yet don't recognise kiting as sailing! what ludicrous hypocrisy.



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"50 knots?" started by yoyo