Select to expand quoteSubsonic said..
For some perspective, i rigged my favourite sail the other day, it had been a while and i couldnt quite remember exactly where i usually put the downhaul.
The leech was plenty floppy, and i thought i had the right spot. After 2 runs i could feel the sail was well and truly all over the place.
It wasn't even a cm of difference for it to be in the right spot again.
Wtf??? Someone went windsurfing???
Select to expand quoteSparky said..Subsonic said..
For some perspective, i rigged my favourite sail the other day, it had been a while and i couldnt quite remember exactly where i usually put the downhaul.
The leech was plenty floppy, and i thought i had the right spot. After 2 runs i could feel the sail was well and truly all over the place.
It wasn't even a cm of difference for it to be in the right spot again.
Wtf??? Someone went windsurfing???
Yeah. Got a quick one in last fri
Select to expand quoteMark _australia said..
^^^ perfect. Eddie go to 4:50 ish and that's what you're after.
Got it... I will do it exactly like that next time... Thanks
Eddie
Actually I got that downhaul totally wrong. Measure from bottom of mast to bottom of sail pulleys as per picture below.
For your sail this distance should be 23cm.
dont rely on the markings on your extension as they are all a bit different. For example, for my chinooks I set them 2cm longer than the "downhaul" setting as the pulleys are never block to block.
www.windsurf.co.uk/peter-hart-up-and-riding-in-a-flash/
Some very sagely words from one of the most respected teachers of windsurfing in the world. Have a look at the section that starts with "the right sort of power" about tuning your gear. I love his line about "More shape surely equals more power. But bag it too much and the sail turns from a foil to an umbrella. The skill is in tweaking and feeling whether the sail is powering you along or just driving the board under water."
James that makes much more sense, I wondered when you said pulley to pulley, I've never come across that method before.
update:
Went sailing today and things are a lot better. Water Temp 83... Air temp... 75
I rigged the 8.0 because when I arrived it was blowing 12 mph... (measured)
There was a strong cold front one the way so I was not worried.
In no time, wind was up to 21... I took off on my untested board..
For the Sail, I rigged as the video described above. I cranked the downhaul all I could. Then I pulled the receiver
off the truck and wrapped the rope around it and pulled some more... Ended up with a loose leach on the top 1/3 of the sail.
On the way out the board planed without much effort and I averaged about 15 mph and things were nice and balanced.
I had the mast in the front mast track kind of back.
Feet were in the foot straps and was only leaning forward a bit. It was extra choppy as a old swell was head on. Then I noticed a big gust.
at 3/4 mile out I turned around but fell... I quickly tried to water start but the wind had picked up to over 26-27 (as I found out later)
and I could not do it.
My new board is large and thick so I just up-hauled the sail but I was completely over powered and crashed. This went on for a while
but I made it back going slow and was wore out. No chance of rigging the 6.5... I had nothing left.
This board is 1000x better for me than that 150 shark... even though I was really good 25 years ago. I am not so good right now.
This board seems to match my size as I never sank the back end very much and because of its long wheel base, it really smooths
out the ride. (makes things easier)
The sugar deck I put on it is the bomb... Far more grip than the shark 150 deck.
I want to thank all the people here... If that sail was not rigged like you guys told me to... I might still be out there.
Thanks again.
(pic by park ranger)
Eddie Weeks
Hi Eddie,
good you had success with your self made old school board and that you sail trim is good now.
As for the board, new broader/shorter boards are different to plane. Try the following to get planing: front foot directly at/besides the mast base with toes pointing straight forward and front foot stretched. Rear foot at the center between front and rear straps, knee slightly bent. Body and head facing forwards. Be hooked in. As soon as a gust comes, go downwind around 120-130 degrees - much more than in older shapes.
Most of your weight should be in the harness and front foot, less weight on the back foot. You will get planing immediately. Only then you put the front foot in the straps. When you really picked up speed and the fin creates sufficient lift, then put the rear foot into the straps. And only when you further pick up speed, you turn 90-85 degrees to the wind.
Get used to new boards, they are fun if you adapt to them.
best regards
mariachi76
Is the shark 150 a good modern board ?... Am I too big for it at 245 lbs.
I still don't under stand completely how it can only use sails from 6.5 - 9.0.
I will bring both boards with me from now on. I try the shark again with a 6.5 rigged right.
Eddie
Select to expand quoteEddieWeeks said..
Is the shark 150 a good modern board ?... Am I too big for it at 245 lbs.
I still don't under stand completely how it can only use sails from 6.5 - 9.0.
I will bring both boards with me from now on. I try the shark again with a 6.5 rigged right.
Eddie
Hi Eddieweeks,
I have no personal experience with the shark 150, but it seems to be a moderate performing freeride board with reasonable early planing abilities (www.windsurf.co.uk/test/fanatic-shark-ltd-150l-2013-test-review/). I would think it is a suitable board for you to restart windsurfing, although your body and brain soon will remember your previous skills and will want a better/faster/smaller board :-).
The board size of 150L for your weight is suitable for winds from 13 to 19 kn. Below 13kn, you probably wont get planing or need lots of pumping. And above 20kn it will be difficult to control.
So I don't know where you got the recommendation of 6.5 to 9.0 sail size, but 6.5 is definitely way too small for this board size and your weight.
The following recommendations I give you for your weight and this 150L board:
For 13kn-16kn, get a 9.5-10 m2 sail.
For 17-20kn, your 8.0 sail will work
And as I I said, above 20kn, that board is too big anyway, i.e. becomes very difficult to control as with stronger winds, the water gets more choppy.
Theoreticallly, you could put a 6.5 on your board, but you would need >25kn to get planing - and your board will be uncontrollable at that wind speed. In other words, a 6.5 makes no sense at all for this board and your weight.
As for the fins, use the bigger one you have. For this board, the sweet spot for a 52cm fin is at around 16kn. The 35cm will never ever work on this board. You might want to try maybe a 46cm fin for the upper wind range of 18-20kn, but that is fine tuning already.
For 20-25kn, a ~125L board would be then more suitable later on, once you got your skills back. On a 125L board you might use the 8.0 and 6.5 in that wind range.
What I would als recommend you: Get a good windsurfing teacher for one hour, let him check your equipment setup, strap position, downhaul/outhaul/rigging and your position when trying to get planing. That would be well invested money and you soon will fly over the water again!
best regards
mariachi76
Select to expand quoteEddieWeeks said..
Is the shark 150 a good modern board ?... Am I too big for it at 245 lbs.
I still don't under stand completely how it can only use sails from 6.5 - 9.0.
I will bring both boards with me from now on. I try the shark again with a 6.5 rigged right.
Eddie
I don't know if it's a good board or not.
to plane consistently in wind under 12 knots you will need a foil or a longboard. at 105kg I find 12 knots for me is a line in the sand for short boards.
i used to use a formula board and 8.5m sail which would get me consistently planning in 12 knots after pumping.
these days I use a 125lt board and 7.2m sail with 36cm fin for 12 knots but as soon as it's 15 knots i'm able to plane consistently on a 6.2m sail and 24cm fin. I've varied from 105kg to 115kg over the years and currently 105.
not to suggest everyone wants to use the smallest gear they can but to suggest that it is every bit possible for smaller gear to get larger guys going in a freeride situation. it is just a matter of practice and time for you to get back into the swing of things.
I agree with the comments that you need your sail working properly to get going. correctly rigged with the right mast. the other major factor is stance
update:
Sailed tropical storm Nestor yesterday... Had a great day... 22-24 mph... higher gust
Could not decide on sail... But because of advice given here, I chose the bigger one Ezzy 6.5.... It was perfect
Cranked the downhaul. (Like I was told) top 1/3 of the sail became loose... and I was off...
Because of the properly tuned sail and a big board. I was conformable and could relax. This is important.
Top speed was 26 mph and was planing %90 of the time...
Once the board speed was over 20 mph... this board was too big... a lot too big...
As soon as the sail started pulling hard, it would start planing.
My new seat harness worked great. I did 5 high speed jibs without falling... This board does not turn easily, and my back foot
never found the edge of the board when I took it out of the strap and stomped on the downwind side to turn... LOL
I know this weird looking board, may not be the best... but for my weight and level, I am having a blast..
Thanks for all the help
Short video of a fat boy on a fat board
Shark 150 is a great board for 16-30 mph winds for your size.
Thin in the back, slight fsw rocker, and narrow tail for it's with and heavy weight.. a great medium high wind flattish water board for big guys.
At 150 lbs., it's best for 17-25 mph winds and flattish water...but my 90liter boards plane sooner.
Shark 150 is a great board for 16-30 mph winds for your size.
Thin in the back, slight fsw rocker, and narrow tail for it's with and heavy weight.. a great medium high wind flattish water board for big guys.
At 150 lbs., it's best for 17-25 mph winds and flattish water...but my 90liter boards plane sooner.
Select to expand quoteLeeD said..
Shark 150 is a great board for 16-30 mph winds for your size.
Thin in the back, slight fsw rocker, and narrow tail for it's with and heavy weight.. a great medium high wind flattish water board for big guys.
At 150 lbs., it's best for 17-25 mph winds and flattish water...but my 90liter boards plane sooner.
It says on the side of the board for 6.5-9.0 sails.... How in the world can I use it in 30 mph... I tried.. It was a disaster
Eddie
At 150 lbs., I've had fun sessions with 5.5 in winds of 17-27 mph.
With my FSW's, I'd be on 4.5 sized sails.
Big heavy board is not overpowered and plows thru chop.
Eddie im around your weight. I use Ezzy sails. Ride 150 AHD circa 2000.
What made it a disaster?
The problem I had, on two different trips.... I was using a Ezzy 5.5... 52cm fin.
The sail on each trip, did not have enough down haul.
The sail was too far forward and/or the foot straps were too far back... (I moved the masted track many times, no help)
I have sailed the Shark 150 with a 8.0... and all was good... Got in the straps and was balanced, but not relaxed.
Now... there is a chance... my brain is still wired for 1990 equipment and I could not adapt...
The board I built has the foot straps 2-3 inches forward and is a much wider board... I have become very relaxed on this board..
Its just easier.
Eddie
^^ choosing a smaller fin for that size sail will make a big difference. That combo would want to point high all the time.
Yes todays boards n sails need a different stance to the old gear.
Today's boards can all use a modern slalom stance, which is exactly the mid 90's stance.
Footstraps 22" apart, mast track 20-23.5" ahead of center of front foot strap.
That doesn't work for wave or freestyle, but is the fastest and best stance for planing jibes.
At the end of the day... Things started to come back to me.
This board does not turn easily, but I am heavy enough to make it turn.
Thanks again for all the help
Eddie
I HAVE a Shark 150 sitting on the board rack.
Stock 50 cm is fine with 5.5 in winds of 17-25 for me.
I've also used a 13" swept pointer, a bit smaller 5.5 in 18-24mph winds.
Straps out and back, my just back from center.
Select to expand quotefirerock said..
Eddie,
Owned a 150 Shark for a few months during my early progression. If I remember correctly, I found that mast track back 1cm & footstraps forward and out worked best for My sailing. The board felt very sticky and required more wind than you'd think. I had to push it hard off wind to get it to unstick. Sails used were 6.5 & 7.5 Cheetah's in ocean conditions. Anything under 6.5 at my weight of 93kg's, and the board wasn't fun. Also, the stock fin was thin & didn't have enough power for heavier riders.
Replaced the shark with a thicker tailed futura... best decision ever!
Great looking board!
Maybe some outer strap holes?
Let us know how she goes....
Spend a fair bit of time on the Shark 150. Hover around 90=100kgs depending on my winter prep
skill level = always the keeen beginner
^^^^^ above post summarises my love/hate with the shark. And my joy at now riding a Futura.
2016 i was successfully planing a number of different boards. Bic 283 techno. Jp Slw fat board and fanatic stingray 155tt
At that stage I could plane boards getting my back foot in first but was obsessed with doing it the 'correct' way "front foot first". I broke the stingray and was struggling to find a middle wind board that I could easily uphaul if stuck in rough water with no wind.
Well the shark 150 was a difficult board to master and get easily onto the plane. I now have a lot more success with it these days .... it needs a lot of bear off the wind and power to get going much more than my other fat boy boards.
I generally sail it with 8.5 and 7.5 ezzy. Found the standard fin hopeless for me to get going. Theses days fin varies from 50cm slalom fin down to 44cm freeride fin. In winds that require 6m or smaller the board is difficult to keep in the water. 133 starboard carve slightly narrower much more controlled
generally the shark gets used when my Futura 150 is needing repairs = it's a much more reliable ride however shark is better as water gets rougher
dont get me wrong I've had some great days on the shark. It holds my pb for distance = measily 44kms and speed averages
Somedays I still get PTSD remembering how hard it was to get going in the early days when I was successful on other boards = a humbling experience ,,,, reckon I lost half a season coming to grips with it
takeaways. Don't load the tail. I've got outboard straps. Plenty of sail. Drive it off down wind to get on the plane. It's not a very good passive planer.
Some shark videos of an old man working on his poor techniques.....
Shark 150 videos
Select to expand quoteLeeD said..
I HAVE a Shark 150 sitting on the board rack.
Stock 50 cm is fine with 5.5 in winds of 17-25 for me.
I've also used a 13" swept pointer, a bit smaller 5.5 in 18-24mph winds.
Straps out and back, my just back from center.
Put 90 lbs on your back and let us know how it goes...
jirvin4505: Super useful information.
This winter I will build a new smaller board... I would like your input as a big boy.
Boy, Eddie, you must have comprehension problems after you read.
My old roomate, a speed trailer, was 275 lbs.
Another former roomie and speed trailer was 235 lbs.
Best bud for 3 seasons was 265 lbs.
I worked at windsurf shops for 22 years.
What would I know of the needs of big sailors?
And, I rode the Shark 150 this summer.
Why are you rooming with trailers?? Don't they belong in the carpark"??
Must be good to be so unreal!!
I have question !!.
I was talking to a kite boarder. Talking about kite size. She said that the 8.0 m^2 kite is not really 8.0, and gave some reasons.
When I sailed in the 90's my sail was 55 square feet. or 5.0 m^2.
Now my Ezzy sails are 5.5 and 6.5 m^2.
Is that the real size. Or do they cheat a bit like the kites ?
Thanks.. Eddie
ps.. I have been telling everyone, they can't have a fast board unless it has a point on the front... LOL
Kites are curved from the bridle and from the pumped in air, so the projected size is quite different than the size measured on a flat ground or surface.
I could never get my custom cutoff shapes, Berkey Spoons, or Naish Slalom Stubs to go as fast as my older long no noses.
