Select to expand quotePaducah said..kiter49 said..
May be if the new material Aluula that Ocean Rodeo are using this year for their kites is used for the wingfoils it could help with their weight , it cuts the weight by a good margin for the main strut and this material is supposed to be more reliable . For the moment the wings are at their very beginning and are far from a good windsurf sail in term of performance and quality .
It'll certainly help you foil sooner by lightening your wallet significantly. Looks like Aluula kites are 50% more than their normal kite.
example: www.eastcoastkitesurfing.com.au/kites/
If I'm having to pay $1200 US for a wing, I'm going to be windfoiling for quite some time.
What will be interesting is when the cheap Asian wings make it to the big box stores who can sell it next to their cheap paddle boards. Most of those will never foil but it's an interesting gateway.
Humm , I don't want to get into tag prices in these sports this could be a very long thread , Aluula seems to boost the price that is right but this material could change the entire sport of sailing/kiting ect .
I'm finding this difficult reading. The pros and cons of each separated by a small d or g. A novice looking to take up one or the other will have no hope here. One of them needs a distinctive name.
I'm concerned the winDfoil will fade once the supply of ageing windsurfers dries up. For mucking about off-the-beach sailing the winGfoil might be the go. A youngster coming out of Opti dinghies looking for off-the-beach, point-to-point performance to blow everybody away is going to go kite foiling.
I'm just love all things foiling.
Eventually when I move to the coast I'll add in WWF, surf/SUP foiling to the wind foil and wing dinging.
I actually found the learning curve (especially with gybes) to be longer than wind foiling. It's interesting to read that whenever a new discipline arrives people jump on the light wind side of the spectrum? I love wing dinging in the super strong winds and know I can easily rig a sail if the wind backs off, not at this time interested with a 7m wing
4.6 in 20-35 knots
Select to expand quoteCoreAS said..
I'm just love all things foiling.
Eventually when I move to the coast I'll add in WWF, surf/SUP foiling to the wind foil and wing dinging.
I actually found the learning curve (especially with gybes) to be longer than wind foiling. It's interesting to read that whenever a new discipline arrives people jump on the light wind side of the spectrum? I love wing dinging in the super strong winds and know I can easily rig a sail if the wind backs off, not at this time interested with a 7m wing
4.6 in 20-35 knots
I think we are twins
I haven't tried it yet... but i definitely will. A friend of mine is doing pretty good with it, considering he has zero wind sports background.
I too have shoulder issues, so "holding" the wing up concerns me a bit.
I must admit the ease of transport and multi surface possibilities are very appealing.
But I'll gladly wait until they have it figured out.
Hopefully that Alula material from OR crosses over into regular windsurfing sails too. Higher volume will lead to less cost and I feel like sail design is stable enough to invest in a quiver likely to last 10-15yrs.
Select to expand quoteIan K said..I'm concerned the winDfoil will fade once the supply of ageing windsurfers dries up. For mucking about off-the-beach sailing the winGfoil might be the go. A youngster coming out of Opti dinghies looking for off-the-beach, point-to-point performance to blow everybody away is going to go kite foiling.
Windfoiling is here to stay 
Just like wavesailing is a cut above kiting waves, windfoiling's more awesome than kitefoiling in swells and waves.
At least from what I see locally 
Perhaps mast-base pressure that helps control foil lift when accelerating down swells, gives us an advantage over kites and windwingers.
Optimistic that some windwingers down the track will see the advantages of windfoiling and decide to give it a go.
I might be a little biased 
Select to expand quoteGrantmac said..
I must admit the ease of transport and multi surface possibilities are very appealing.
But I'll gladly wait until they have it figured out.
Hopefully that Alula material from OR crosses over into regular windsurfing sails too. Higher volume will lead to less cost and I feel like sail design is stable enough to invest in a quiver likely to last 10-15yrs.
Yeah. For travel the wind wing comes to mind.
I dont really see the transport advantage. A wingfoil board + wingfoil + wing and all other necessities certainly requires a car and is not transportable by public transport? If it needs a car, you can also put your windfoil board in there right?
I took up kiteboarding next to windfoiling because of transport. I can take the metro and train to the beach and be there in 20 minutes, with all my kit. Thats what I call a transport advantage, not more spare room on one of the back seats.
That being said, I'm all for being an allround watermen and might pick up wingfoiling again in the near future, you guys raised my enthousiasm!
Everybody should at least try to manipulate a wing , so I say let's find a friend on the beach who would let you take a wing in your hands and walk , run and jibe with it on the beach , it is amazing how easy it is to jibe and ride . I bought a 5 meters wing last winter to ride on my ice-board and this got me lazy and I never rig a windsurf sail of the winter season . Now I feel there is a lot to improve , these are still floating trash bags from my point of view (compared to what they are going to be very soon ), this remind me back in 2000 the bad foil kites behaviors , now a foil kite is a very good performer and so will these wings within the next few years and like I said earlier , with the new coming material these wings will get very light and popular . So again : let's borrow a wing for 10 minutes guys and come back talking about it ! These wings are here to stay and so are the windsurfing sails .
Select to expand quoteWhiteofHeart said..
I dont really see the transport advantage. A wingfoil board + wingfoil + wing and all other necessities certainly requires a car and is not transportable by public transport? If it needs a car, you can also put your windfoil board in there right?
I took up kiteboarding next to windfoiling because of transport. I can take the metro and train to the beach and be there in 20 minutes, with all my kit. Thats what I call a transport advantage, not more spare room on one of the back seats.
That being said, I'm all for being an allround watermen and might pick up wingfoiling again in the near future, you guys raised my enthousiasm!
For riding the metro not so much, but wing foiling is still much easier to pack in a car, SUV etc with a 6' board, back pack and pump versus multiple sails, multiple masts, boom, foil, board, harness, spare mast bases, rope, harness lines etc.
Rigging time is a lot less...
bolt the foil on - 2 mins
pump wing Up - 45 seconds
Rigging time can be a big deal where I live, the wind can whip up and die off pretty fast and if you're messing about with rigs and wing sizes you could lose the window of opportunity.
Coming from a bay and wave sailing background I thought they were a bit of a joke when I first saw them but I'm a strong believer in the old saying 'don't knock it till you have given it a decent go'. At 70kg my lower wind limit for fun planing is around 17 knots average on freewave gear and have been toying with the idea of WindFoiling to get out in <17 knots. Tried it two summers ago and got up on foil in the first session enough to know it was cool and would fill the gap but just didn't get me very excited. This summer I tried the wing ding thing and it was way more challenging, took 3 sessions before I got some decent foiling runs but was hooked. Feel so much more freedom foiling with the wing and being able to completely depower and ride downwind swell is really something. This sport is really going to bring in a lot of new wind/water people and cross over to a lot of wind and kite surfers. If kite surfing is the dark side I wonder what wing foiling will be labeled?
Being able to set up a decent new Wingfoil package for under $4k which covers in my case 12-20 knots is crazy compared to windsurfing kit to do the same. Still love windsurfing but already rethinking my quiver coz I don't think I'll be bothering in <18 knots anymore. 6 sessions in and I am flying around in gybes but still a way off completing switching in the transition. Below is the christening of my birthday pressie and 4th session. Gear improvements in the next few years should be amazing.
I was thinking more air travel with wing and inflatable sup foil, if such a thing exists.
The sup revolution kept our windsurfing gear manufacturers afloat, hopefully wing dinging does the same for them.
All things wind and wave are good
Select to expand quoteboardsurfr said..
I can't really imagine many kiters switching to wind wings. Some don't want to foil, and those who do can get going in less wind that wind foilers.
at one of my local beaches, a bunch of kite foilers are going nearly full time wingdinging including some of the best kite foil racers. perhaps this is with respect to the current state of things that sees no organized racing happening in the near future, but we are seeing wingdinging pulling a lot of participants from kiting. I also have friends who windsurf who had zero interest in windsurf foiling but all of a sudden want to try wingdinging. I can't explain it. Also have friends who used to windsurf a long time ago and winging has brought them back into wind sports after 20yr hiatus.
I'm about 40-50 days in now. For me winging has maybe been a little easier to learn than windsurf foiling but both in the same general category. I have a pretty strong background in freestyle windsurfing... not sure if that helps or not.
Some of my friends have been wondering if I've ditched windsurfing completely for winging... absolutely not. I do find the range of the wing pretty immense. I've been taking out my 4m in 25+ when I can windsurf powered up on 4.2/85 (87kg) and I can take the same kit out when it's blowing 15kt like yesterday when my friend who is much lighter is kite foiling on a 7m. My friend is another one of those people who is now wing-curious.
Select to expand quotethedoor said..
I was thinking more air travel with wing and inflatable sup foil, if such a thing exists.
The sup revolution kept our windsurfing gear manufacturers afloat, hopefully wing dinging does the same for them.
All things wind and wave are good
You mean like this?
mantafoils.ecwid.com/#!/Inflatable-supfoil-wingfoil-board-110L/p/147850085/category=37097018
That inflatable is exactly what I'm talking about. If only they also put a mast base on the front ??
Hopefully Duo releases an semi-inflatable foil board. Then everything could fit in one very heavy backpack capable of being put in the seat of any rental car.
Select to expand quotePaducah said..thedoor said..
I was thinking more air travel with wing and inflatable sup foil, if such a thing exists.
The sup revolution kept our windsurfing gear manufacturers afloat, hopefully wing dinging does the same for them.
All things wind and wave are good
You mean like this?
mantafoils.ecwid.com/#!/Inflatable-supfoil-wingfoil-board-110L/p/147850085/category=37097018
Yeah. Sardinia here I come.
I am going to foil there though, to maintain social distancing
No way, not interested in the slightest. Its inefficient when it comes to making the most of the breeze and doesn't have any of the things I like about windfoiling. I like being powered up on big race gear, screaming across the water with the board on an angle. Im not keen on standing upright on a plank holding an umbrella above my head, but to each their own. :)
Select to expand quoteMaddlad said..
No way, not interested in the slightest. Its inefficient when it comes to making the most of the breeze and doesn't have any of the things I like about windfoiling. I like being powered up on big race gear, screaming across the water with the board on an angle. Im not keen on standing upright on a plank holding an umbrella above my head, but to each their own. :)
I hear ya! There is nothing like the feeling of being lit up on your traditional windsurfing board going nuts across the water, and jumping waves. I was wondering if windfoiling would deliver that same windsurfing feeling, and found out it does, but in a more modified, modern way. I still get the rush I want from windfoiling that I do with windsurfing.
Maybe for use when riding waves, but apart from that I cannot see the point.Windfoiling much more effcient, can use a harness and not hanging onto something over my head
I have enough toys already.
my van long since overfilled (yeah, one day i might get a trailer as well...) i have all bases covered with the gear i've got, hardly have time to use it all at the moment.
I think I'll leave the wing dinging for now.
Select to expand quoteSubsonic said..
I have enough toys already.
my van long since overfilled (yeah, one day i might get a trailer as well...) i have all bases covered with the gear i've got, hardly have time to use it all at the moment.
I think I'll leave the wing dinging for now.
That's what you said about foils...and now look at us all.. :P
If you ask me the sport that stands to lose the greatest share of its participants to wingfoiling isn't windfoiling, it's SUP foiling, particularly downwind. Just look at the SUP foiling forum and how it is now pretty much a wingfoil forum. The last couple seasons I started seeing SUP foilers in the Gorge pass through sailing spots trying to catch bumps, but with a couple exceptions of well known pros, nobody would really catch all that much. feltI bad for them, especially with kiters and windsurfers slaying it all around them. The SUP foilers were working so hard trying to keep their balance in the swells while it was blowing a solid 25mph. Swapping the foil SUP for a lunch tray of a board and a wingfoil wing for downwinders makes so much more sense and seems like it would be amazing fun, right up there with windfoiling. Basically any time you are downwind SUP foiling it is inherently windy, so why not make use of it?
Select to expand quoteCoreAS said..WhiteofHeart said..
I dont really see the transport advantage. A wingfoil board + wingfoil + wing and all other necessities certainly requires a car and is not transportable by public transport? If it needs a car, you can also put your windfoil board in there right?
I took up kiteboarding next to windfoiling because of transport. I can take the metro and train to the beach and be there in 20 minutes, with all my kit. Thats what I call a transport advantage, not more spare room on one of the back seats.
That being said, I'm all for being an allround watermen and might pick up wingfoiling again in the near future, you guys raised my enthousiasm!
For riding the metro not so much, but wing foiling is still much easier to pack in a car, SUV etc with a 6' board, back pack and pump versus multiple sails, multiple masts, boom, foil, board, harness, spare mast bases, rope, harness lines etc.
Rigging time is a lot less...
bolt the foil on - 2 mins
pump wing Up - 45 seconds
Rigging time can be a big deal where I live, the wind can whip up and die off pretty fast and if you're messing about with rigs and wing sizes you could lose the window of opportunity.
1 4.7 wavesail and 1 board with 1 foil gives me 12-25 knots of windrange, with being able to hold on in gusts over 35. In reality you only need to bring 1 sail, its just that people like being perfectly powered all the time and (as you say) are messing about with wings and rugs too much because they cab. No wing I've tried is gonna allow such windrange. A 4.7 wavesail rigs in 3-5 minutes depending on coffee consumption, and a pocket foilboard isnt any harder to stuff in a car than a wingfoil board or sup.
I still do not see the advantage in transport, although you maybe shave 3 minutes off your rigging time.
Luckily they sound almost the same. My Wife asked 'What's all that shiny new stuff?' ...and I just said 'Oh, that's just windgdgsurfing gear'
Select to expand quoteda vecta said..
Luckily they sound almost the same. My Wife asked 'What's all that shiny new stuff?' ...and I just said 'Oh, that's just windgdgsurfing gear'
Good thinking I'll have to try that!
Before I got back into windsurfing/wind foiling, I was doing lots of point to point downwind paddle boarding on a 16 foot SIC Maui F16 with steering. We chased conditions all over the state of Michigan. About the time downwinding with a SUP foil, I got screwed out of my own company by a guy I took on as a partner. Subsequently, I no longer have the time to chase those conditions with my downwind buddies. I can windfoil 6 minutes from the shop i work at now, which has turned out to be a great thing for me mentally, emotionally and physically. With the wingding coming along, I will most likely pick one up to do wing assisted downwind on a foil board, perhaps on my Levitator 160 for now. If it goes well, I'll buy a board better suited for winging. I was hoping to downwind windfoil, but getting out through Great Lakes surf with a windsurf rig would most likely prove disastrous for me. With a wing, I would guess I could paddle out and then get going. There's a handful of guys from my area who are learning the wing. MacKite in Grand Haven Michigan is doing a bang-up job of promoting foiling with a wingding.
Select to expand quoteWhiteofHeart said..CoreAS said..WhiteofHeart said..
I dont really see the transport advantage. A wingfoil board + wingfoil + wing and all other necessities certainly requires a car and is not transportable by public transport? If it needs a car, you can also put your windfoil board in there right?
I took up kiteboarding next to windfoiling because of transport. I can take the metro and train to the beach and be there in 20 minutes, with all my kit. Thats what I call a transport advantage, not more spare room on one of the back seats.
That being said, I'm all for being an allround watermen and might pick up wingfoiling again in the near future, you guys raised my enthousiasm!
For riding the metro not so much, but wing foiling is still much easier to pack in a car, SUV etc with a 6' board, back pack and pump versus multiple sails, multiple masts, boom, foil, board, harness, spare mast bases, rope, harness lines etc.
Rigging time is a lot less...
bolt the foil on - 2 mins
pump wing Up - 45 seconds
Rigging time can be a big deal where I live, the wind can whip up and die off pretty fast and if you're messing about with rigs and wing sizes you could lose the window of opportunity.
1 4.7 wavesail and 1 board with 1 foil gives me 12-25 knots of windrange, with being able to hold on in gusts over 35. In reality you only need to bring 1 sail, its just that people like being perfectly powered all the time and (as you say) are messing about with wings and rugs too much because they cab. No wing I've tried is gonna allow such windrange. A 4.7 wavesail rigs in 3-5 minutes depending on coffee consumption, and a pocket foilboard isnt any harder to stuff in a car than a wingfoil board or sup.
I still do not see the advantage in transport, although you maybe shave 3 minutes off your rigging time.Select to expand quoteWhiteofHeart said..CoreAS said..WhiteofHeart said..
I dont really see the transport advantage. A wingfoil board + wingfoil + wing and all other necessities certainly requires a car and is not transportable by public transport? If it needs a car, you can also put your windfoil board in there right?
I took up kiteboarding next to windfoiling because of transport. I can take the metro and train to the beach and be there in 20 minutes, with all my kit. Thats what I call a transport advantage, not more spare room on one of the back seats.
That being said, I'm all for being an allround watermen and might pick up wingfoiling again in the near future, you guys raised my enthousiasm!
For riding the metro not so much, but wing foiling is still much easier to pack in a car, SUV etc with a 6' board, back pack and pump versus multiple sails, multiple masts, boom, foil, board, harness, spare mast bases, rope, harness lines etc.
Rigging time is a lot less...
bolt the foil on - 2 mins
pump wing Up - 45 seconds
Rigging time can be a big deal where I live, the wind can whip up and die off pretty fast and if you're messing about with rigs and wing sizes you could lose the window of opportunity.
1 4.7 wavesail and 1 board with 1 foil gives me 12-25 knots of windrange, with being able to hold on in gusts over 35. In reality you only need to bring 1 sail, its just that people like being perfectly powered all the time and (as you say) are messing about with wings and rugs too much because they cab. No wing I've tried is gonna allow such windrange. A 4.7 wavesail rigs in 3-5 minutes depending on coffee consumption, and a pocket foilboard isnt any harder to stuff in a car than a wingfoil board or sup.
I still do not see the advantage in transport, although you maybe shave 3 minutes off your rigging
Most areas in the world you wouldn't get much foiling in with just a 4.7! Most places you probably need minimum 3 sails.
I can rig 4.0 to 5.8 on one boom but need 3 masts and 3 foil wings.
I can use a 4.6 wing surfer in 15-35 (last week) with one wing foil (SS 84/42).
Select to expand quoteexcav8ter said..
....MacKite in Grand Haven Michigan is doing a bang-up job of promoting foiling with a wingding.
I think the kite retailers will push it hard as kite growth in most spots has flattened and the population is graying just like windsurfing 20-25 years ago.
Sorry about the work situation - glad time on the water finds you peace.
