Select to expand quoteCoreAS said..
see you at the weekend, and I'll bring the ibuprofen 
let the fun commence.
LoL, I'll already be dosed up before we start - Vitamin I is the only thing that keeps us old guys going!
Select to expand quotejims said..CoreAS said..
see you at the weekend, and I'll bring the ibuprofen let the fun commence.
LoL, I'll already be dosed up before we start - Vitamin I is the only thing that keeps us old guys going!
Yeah, I would have agreed with you two years ago, but now I take 5 grams of pure creatine monohydrate before a session (SixStar brand), and the same afterwards, and no more pain. But if I am sore the next morning, 5 grams again and 1-2 hrs later I am pain free. Creatine is a natural compound our bodies make for muscle energy and repair, but as we age we make less.
Select to expand quoteSandman1221 said..jims said..CoreAS said..
see you at the weekend, and I'll bring the ibuprofen let the fun commence.
LoL, I'll already be dosed up before we start - Vitamin I is the only thing that keeps us old guys going!
Yeah, I would have agreed with you two years ago, but now I take 5 grams of pure creatine monohydrate before a session (SixStar brand), and the same afterwards, and no more pain. But if I am sore the next morning, 5 grams again and 1-2 hrs later I am pain free. Creatine is a natural compound our bodies make for muscle energy and repair, but as we age we make less.
Creatine is good stuff, I used to cycle it when I was younger, but I tend to hold water and can put mass on very easily.
Now I have a daily cocktail of multivitamin, branch chain aminos, apple cider vinegar and fish oil. Right after foiling I drink 40g protein shake to refuel, It definitely helps.
Select to expand quoteCoreAS said..Sandman1221 said..jims said..CoreAS said..
see you at the weekend, and I'll bring the ibuprofen let the fun commence.
LoL, I'll already be dosed up before we start - Vitamin I is the only thing that keeps us old guys going!
Yeah, I would have agreed with you two years ago, but now I take 5 grams of pure creatine monohydrate before a session (SixStar brand), and the same afterwards, and no more pain. But if I am sore the next morning, 5 grams again and 1-2 hrs later I am pain free. Creatine is a natural compound our bodies make for muscle energy and repair, but as we age we make less.
Creatine is good stuff, I used to cycle it when I was younger, but I tend to hold water and can put mass on very easily.
Now I have a daily cocktail of multivitamin, branch chain aminos, apple cider vinegar and fish oil. Right after foiling I drink 40g protein shake to refuel, It definitely helps.
All stuff that would be happily go through you without being absorbed, or when it does, will do way more damage than good. For well written introductory articles about supplements: www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2013/07/the-vitamin-myth-why-we-think-we-need-supplements/277947/ or www.nytimes.com/2019/04/08/well/eat/choose-foods-not-supplements.html
Select to expand quoteduzzi said..CoreAS said..Sandman1221 said..jims said..CoreAS said..
see you at the weekend, and I'll bring the ibuprofen let the fun commence.
LoL, I'll already be dosed up before we start - Vitamin I is the only thing that keeps us old guys going!
Yeah, I would have agreed with you two years ago, but now I take 5 grams of pure creatine monohydrate before a session (SixStar brand), and the same afterwards, and no more pain. But if I am sore the next morning, 5 grams again and 1-2 hrs later I am pain free. Creatine is a natural compound our bodies make for muscle energy and repair, but as we age we make less.
Creatine is good stuff, I used to cycle it when I was younger, but I tend to hold water and can put mass on very easily.
Now I have a daily cocktail of multivitamin, branch chain aminos, apple cider vinegar and fish oil. Right after foiling I drink 40g protein shake to refuel, It definitely helps.
All stuff that would be happily go through you without being absorbed, or when it does, will do way more damage than good. For well written introductory articles about supplements: www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2013/07/the-vitamin-myth-why-we-think-we-need-supplements/277947/ or www.nytimes.com/2019/04/08/well/eat/choose-foods-not-supplements.html
Seven pages into this thread and, for once, duzzi and I are on the same page...
Select to expand quotejims said..
THE SEARCH IS OVER!
I've decided that windsurf foiling basically sucks, and I want no part of it. LONG LIVE THE FIN!!!!!
Ok, not really - not yet, at least. (We'll see how many catapults I can endure, then figure out where I stand on things... :-)
All the input, advice, warnings, feedback, etc that you all have provided me in the scant week that this thread has been alive has been of incredible help and value. I've also appreciated and enjoyed the spirited discussions, comparisons, and some (generally :-) good-natured back and forth - it all helped me build up a basic sense of what I needed and what I should be looking for. This is a really great online community!
In the end, the advice to contact CoreAS (Dean) was spot-on. He initially offered me a used Wizard 125 for a very good price, and on further discussion, was also able to pull together a complete I76 foil with a compatible mast head, so it all fits together and is properly balanced. Dean is also throwing in a board bag, u-joint base (he quickly convinced me that a rubber hourglass is a liability when trying to hook things up on the water), and a (pin) compatible mast extension. Remarkably, this all fits comfortably within my budget, too. (Dean is also planning to spend some time on the water with me when I drive down to pick it all up this coming weekend, so that I have some basics to work on when I get back to the little pond at home!)
I own CoreAS/Dean a serious debt of gratitude. He listened to what I was looking for, he tracked down all the necessary bits and pieces to make it all work and fit, he offered it to me at an incredibly reasonable price, and he's going to show me how to use it. He has gone way above and beyond what I would have hoped for or asked of anyone, and has made this a do-able (and far less stressful) decision and process for me. I hadn't initially realized that he is a shop owner, but now that I know, if anyone is looking for equipment, lessons, etc, I can highly recommend working with Dean - if he treats you even half as good as he's treated me, I think you'll be very satisfied.
www.coreadventuresports.com/
www.facebook.com/coreadventuresports
Thank You, All, and Thanks Especially to CoreAS/Dean!!!!
I think that is a very good combo. I started with an Infinity 84 (bigger brother of the 76) and I was always amazed at how early the 76 took off and how much faster than my 86 was. I always heard very good things about the 125 wizard as well. Have fun!
I'm first and foremost a cyclist, and being fast uphill is important for me (particularly long hills). The weight gain typically associated w/ Creatine would be detrimental to being fast up long hills, and everything I've read regarding creatine and cycling indicates that it typically only really helps in short, maximal efforts. I'm not a sprinter, and I'll never be a sprinter (I got the skinny gene), so it'd be all cost and no benefit for me.
Bagels are my supplement of choice.
Think I'll continue my supplements off my own research and a medical professional advice than some windsurfers on a foiling thread.
any hoo back to foiling, I agree WillyWind the i76 is quicker on all angles of the wind than the i84. The wizard 125 is a superb board, that board and infinity foil really took my foiling to the next level.
Select to expand quoteCoreAS said..
he wizard 125 is a superb board, that board and infinity foil really took my foiling to the next level.
I'll admit, I'm mildly concerned about the 'level' that 90cm mast will take me to! 
There's no need to worry about a 90 cm mast. In my opinion the idea that people should learn foiling on a short mast is a myth.
It's quite easy to keep the board close to the water on the foil if you are nervous about being above the water. More importantly, a longer mast means you're less likely to breach (bring the foil out of the water) while using a longer foil mast and you're in the inevitable "dolphin" phase of foiling. i.e the longer mast gives you a bigger margin for error.
Select to expand quotejims said..CoreAS said..
he wizard 125 is a superb board, that board and infinity foil really took my foiling to the next level.
I'll admit, I'm mildly concerned about the 'level' that 90cm mast will take me to!
Don't worry about it. The amount of extra energy involved in the crash from a greater height is not as much as the energy saved by being slower than your fullspeed crash on a slapper. The crashes are pretty mild by comparison, but you do have more of them.
Don't worry about crashing at all. It actually happens a lot less than people think after the initial learning stage. Speeds are relatively low, boards are wide and stable, and sails are small and controllable .
The sensation of flight at the beginning is strange and alien, which can intimidate some so they are overly concerned with swimming. You will surprise yourself with how many breaches and touch downs you will actually sail away from.
Jim,
Gregwho is correct the longer mast gives you much more "correction" time, the short masts give you less time and you'll breach much to quickly, I have never agreed with the short mast theory.
No back straps or hooking in either, you'll learn to use rig pressure and gentle foil height control, you'll be in control of your equipment not the equipment in control of you 
I agree with the above, 90cm is the right height mast to learn on. It provides good margin of error. For me, my first flying was a combination of exilloration and terror. The terror quickly subsided as I learned control. Control was all about the proper positioning of footstraps either side of the front wing and the the wiggle of my hips to adjust foil height. Flying became second nature after a few sessions..The exilloration remains.
Agreed. I learned on the 90cm mast. John's description of "exhilaration and terror" is pretty funny and accurate. Now that magical feeling of breaking loose of the surface is addicting. What I didn't expect was the sensation of whats going on under the surface of the water being transmitted up to the board. Like going through turbulent boat wake(miniature speed bumps)After a while, you can "feel" when your about to breach. Enough hours, and muscle memory, and flight control becomes automatic.
Select to expand quoteWsurfAustin said..
Agreed. I learned on the 90cm mast. John's description of "exhilaration and terror" is pretty funny and accurate. Now that magical feeling of breaking loose of the surface is addicting. What I didn't expect was the sensation of whats going on under the surface of the water being transmitted up to the board. Like going through turbulent boat wake(miniature speed bumps)After a while, you can "feel" when your about to breach. Enough hours, and muscle memory, and flight control becomes automatic.
I can usually hear the water turbulence around the foil before a breach and in most instances I can make a quick adjustment to avoid the 
and I foil away .
For me there's a big difference between a breach wind foiling and a breach winging. A breach wind foiling is a heavier duty crash since you're holding onto the boom. If I breach winging I just hold onto the wing and use it like a parachute since it is not attached to the board.
I'd love to try the 125 cm. Phantasm mast!
Select to expand quotedejavu said..WsurfAustin said..
Agreed. I learned on the 90cm mast. John's description of "exhilaration and terror" is pretty funny and accurate. Now that magical feeling of breaking loose of the surface is addicting. What I didn't expect was the sensation of whats going on under the surface of the water being transmitted up to the board. Like going through turbulent boat wake(miniature speed bumps)After a while, you can "feel" when your about to breach. Enough hours, and muscle memory, and flight control becomes automatic.
I can usually hear the water turbulence around the foil before a breach and in most instances I can make a quick adjustment to avoid the and I foil away .
For me there's a big difference between a breach wind foiling and a breach winging. A breach wind foiling is a heavier duty crash since you're holding onto the boom. If I breach winging I just hold onto the wing and use it like a parachute since it is not attached to the board.
I'd love to try the 125 cm. Phantasm mast!
The foil will also spin out in a similar way to a fin when you get too high, as long as you don't gain altitude too fast.
I've balanced on that precarious loose edge many times. Sometimes you can feel a tip breach and recover. Other times...not so much
It seems important to keep a little bit of angle to the board as well, not riding it flat. The spin outs and weird crashes tend to happen more to me if I keep the board flat. I don't think the mast has enough lateral resistance by itself when you're close to max altitude to help you, so you need the wings pushing sideways some.
Select to expand quoteIan K said..jims said..CoreAS said..
he wizard 125 is a superb board, that board and infinity foil really took my foiling to the next level.
I'll admit, I'm mildly concerned about the 'level' that 90cm mast will take me to!
Don't worry about it. The amount of extra energy involved in the crash from a greater height is not as much as the energy saved by being slower than your fullspeed crash on a slapper. The crashes are pretty mild by comparison, but you do have more of them.
Yes, don't worry. If you are like me you will go from basically never, ever crashing (on a windsurf), to be overwhelmed by terror because now you do, and often:
* From a meter plus up! You come down completely out of control after a brief "corrida".
* Form any altitude! You come to a complete, and painful, stop because you hit "something".
* Unpredictably, who knows why it happened. After a wind gust, trying to change direction, passing some chop, moving your feet, just "cruising along".
You can listen to the cheerleaders, but just in case you suspect a bit of denial ... remember one thing: never, ever let go of your boom when you fell!
Select to expand quotePaducah said..duzzi said..CoreAS said..Sandman1221 said..jims said..CoreAS said..
see you at the weekend, and I'll bring the ibuprofen let the fun commence.
LoL, I'll already be dosed up before we start - Vitamin I is the only thing that keeps us old guys going!
Yeah, I would have agreed with you two years ago, but now I take 5 grams of pure creatine monohydrate before a session (SixStar brand), and the same afterwards, and no more pain. But if I am sore the next morning, 5 grams again and 1-2 hrs later I am pain free. Creatine is a natural compound our bodies make for muscle energy and repair, but as we age we make less.
Creatine is good stuff, I used to cycle it when I was younger, but I tend to hold water and can put mass on very easily.
Now I have a daily cocktail of multivitamin, branch chain aminos, apple cider vinegar and fish oil. Right after foiling I drink 40g protein shake to refuel, It definitely helps.
All stuff that would be happily go through you without being absorbed, or when it does, will do way more damage than good. For well written introductory articles about supplements: www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2013/07/the-vitamin-myth-why-we-think-we-need-supplements/277947/ or www.nytimes.com/2019/04/08/well/eat/choose-foods-not-supplements.html
Seven pages into this thread and, for once, duzzi and I are on the same page...
I think I would have many more friends if I loved foiling 
Select to expand quotejims said..
"Don't wooory aboudit..."
Quoth the Crack Dealers...
Just make sure you have a good nose protector, see my write up with pictures of the one I made, you are going to crash just getting your balance working. Try getting an Indo Board or similar balance trainer, will help a lot.
I've got one of these for my epoxy short board. (Short by regular board standards, LoL...). Not sure how far the Wizard nose slopes up, and whether one of these would be sufficient or not.
(For those who like the slappers, BTW, I had a helluva a great day on my 71l Seatrend ATV today!!!)
Sounds like somebody should come up with some alternate lyrics...
"There must be 50 ways to crash your foil..."
Select to expand quoteSandman1221 said..
have heard of guy damaging the nose when using a Surfbent.
I have heard that online too, but never actually seen one. But I know many that damaged their noses without them. If the Surfbent is setup right, you will not damage the nose. What I have heard (no actual evidence) is damage to the mast track. Might be a myth. Fact is that you have to use the right UJ, some of the recessed mast tracks will not work and you need to verify that the mast doesn't hit the front of the nose (all angles). Nothing is bullet proof.
Select to expand quoteZeroVix said..Sandman1221 said..
have heard of guy damaging the nose when using a Surfbent.
I have heard that online too, but never actually seen one. But I know many that damaged their noses without them. If the Surfbent is setup right, you will not damage the nose. What I have heard (no actual evidence) is damage to the mast track. Might be a myth. Fact is that you have to use the right UJ, some of the recessed mast tracks will not work and you need to verify that the mast doesn't hit the front of the nose (all angles). Nothing is bullet proof.
yeah, I heard that the Chinook mast deflector would rip out the mast track, but guys at BigWinds told me that is not true for the newer mast tracks. all the same, either one is going to give the mast a lot of leverage when it hits it. the other issue though, is either one will make it difficult to move the sail around while in the water say after a crash, because the mast will hit it as you use the uphaul line to slide the sail around on the water so it is downwind when you uphaul it.
The nose on the wizard is short nothing like a windsurfing board, it's also built extremely well. You'll be fine!
The Surfbent seems to only work as advertised if you use a universal with a mechanical joint -- a nylon or rubber joint will stretch allowing the mast to make contact with the board. The impact may not be as hard but it's still impact nonetheless. Light race type boards are a problem so you will have to take precautions. The Slingshot boards are heavy and tough so probably not as much as an issue. My Starboard race boards got murdered but my Slingshot boards are good.
Select to expand quoteSandman1221 said..
have heard of guy damaging the nose when using a Surfbent.
At foilzone there is a review to read.
Asking, if you can damage your nose with surfbent is the wrong question. Proper one could be, how would your board nose have looked without it. That thing works pretty good on flat foil board. On a high pointy wave board nose the hit will simply happen 5cm earlier, giving the tool less range to dampen the impact.
I am using it since 3 years now on each of my boards. The Naish Hover is nice and flat but you can see some small impact marks on the nose. Sometimes when the ax came down I did not believe the board survived but it did. At 100kg full force whipeout I have broken booms but no board nose, yet.
Better stay safe than sorry.
