Bilge keeps filling up - running down battery

Hi folks, I have a small Daydream yacht in the Pittwater and the bilge keeps filling (even when not raining) and it runs down the starter battery which is not great. I bought a Deep Cycle house battery and stuck it on that last week (and disconnected all other electrical devices) and it's drained that as well (and there has been next to no rain this week).

See attached pictures. I'm starting to think I have some type of leak in the hull area or mast base area. Reason I say mast is if you look at the attached pictures the wood near the mast is mouldy which indicates it's wet a lot and I also noticed at the bottom of the mast a small rectangular cut out so I'm wondering if water is somehow coming through that?
The boat would be 20-30 years old and the leaks may be coming directly through the hull but how do you detect where and how do you plug it?

I've sadly enjoyed the bailing out of bilge water but I'm over it now (new to sailing)!!! Also with two batteries (Starter and House) I do not want the bilge pump draining either of them continuously when I connect them in parallel.

The key is water is getting into the bilge even when it's not raining (and draining the battery)

Any ideas to solve would be appreciated.

Thanks

Paul

The water will have come in the mast exits where halyards enter, not much chance of stopping it one way would be to wrap the exits you can get to with plastic and tape. Remove the mould from the hull with exit mould ,eucalyptus oil or oil of cloves in a spray bottle diluted with water.

Cut out a new floor board or dry out the old one and repaint it, but is your bilge pump running because the float switch is jammed or not working properly.

All the best a mate of mine sailed one of those Daydream's to South America they are great boats.

All the best

Anthony

Hi Anthony, noted on the Exit Mould and Eucalyptus oil. I will give that a burl ASAP. I might plug that small rectangle at the bottom of the mast as well. If it backs up the mast it will only run out the halyard holes and away.

I'm going to cut out a new floor board, raise it a little (20-30 mm)
The bilge pump is set to auto when I leave the boat so it only runs when water gets to a certain level in the bilge. I'm tempted to buy a new one and install to see if that makes a difference. Where is the float switch on the bilge pump?

Good little yacht, enjoying doing it up but this constant water in the bilge and the draining of the batteries is a pain. I need to solve the issue.

Cheers

That's pretty sucky to say the least.

So yeh, first things first, sort out the leaks. How much would be in there if you didn't have the pump onboard at all? The only real way to know for sure would be to pull the boat out, run a moisture sensor over it and see what takes the longest to (or doesn't) dry out. That, of course is $$$$. Probably your best option to find the leaks is to completely empty it and wipe it dry. Then, lay down some paper/cardboard/nappies near each of the areas you suspect, like the mast. Come back after a day and see what's soaked up the water. When you know that, you can decide on what sort of running or permanent repairs you can do.

Now, as for the battery situation, you should be able to rely on the pump not running it down too. I've got the exact same pump as you, a 20ah AGM battery from Whitworths and a tiny 10W solar panel from eBay. I'm going to add a solar controller (more to make it easier to monitor the voltage), but you can do without it to get you started. I picked up mine for about $35 or so.

Hi Twodogs

Sole Mini 14
Can't see any rot near the mast base meeting hull area as it's covered by that white rectangle of wood. I might see if I can remove that and have a look.
Salty I believe it is but will double check

Thanks

Thanks and noted Muzz on the stern gland. Not sure what it is or what it looks like but I will find it and check.

Where the shaft goes through the hull at the back area of the boat there is some water but not much and it doesn't fill up much. It is higher than the bilge and I'm sure no water flows from that area down to bilge area as there are separating wood slats.
Will check it though.

Thanks

MLCHereICOME, I have a used one of these www.trektransponder.com.au for sale with a float switch attached. It will warn you if your batteries get low or bilge fills.

When I bought my Martzcraft 35 it had the same problem so I designed (my business) an SMS alarm that would tell me before I ruined my next set of batteries. (After I ruined my second set of AGM's actually). It became the product above and saved me a lot of $$$ in ruined batteries/bilge pumps/stress. Send me a message if you would like to get it. Im in Parramatta.

You can try, it SMS the word status to my boat trek in Pittwater on 0431 935 720 and wait 30 seconds or so for reply.

BTW, to find where my leaks were when the bilge is full of water back then I poured in little streams of food colouring. Then I could see the currents in the water. Also when everything was dry I painted things with water colour paint. The when it started to get damp I could see it immediately by running droplet marks in the paint.

I would start with the very basics , find all your thru hulls and make sure the hoses have double clamps and are not leaking at the hull end , Follow the hose to check its condition and make sure the other end is ok . Some times when a stop cock is turned off it will still leak so don't assume it actually works . Diesel inboard check all hoses and clamps, stern gland is a possability as mentioned , you can nip them up to stop dripping when you leave the boat but make sure it drips when you are motoring or it can stuff the shaft. , rudder tube if it has one may have a pin hole in it ( the underwater uneadit epoxy will fix that for a while ) pretty much any thing with a hole to below the waterline Should be checked . I did these things when I got my boat and got some nasty surprises . But now you have all our attention let us know what it was , happy hunting

If it is leaking that much you will be able to see it trickle into the bilge. It will be easy to find, 30 minutes of looking you'll see it so follow the trickle.
If salty it will most likely be from:
A inlet. Turn them all off every time you leave the boat. Put your engine key near the engine sea cock.
The stern gland.
The engine cooling system. As I say, turn the cock off.
The final option would be through the hull. Not likely unless it is a timber hull, but if it is it needs to be fixed.
Putting more electrical power in is the wrong answer but one most have considered.

Noted on the Talc powder Slamming. Will keep that in mind.

Thanks Muzz (stern gland). Mine must be greased as there is some type of grease gun connected up to it. Great to know the difference.
Learning something all the time.

Cheers

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MLCHereICOME said...
Hi Morning Bird, I think I have to get all the water out, dry it all with a towel and sit and watch it until I see the leak.
All sea cocks I turn off when I leave (engine cooling sea water, 2 for toilet). Only other entry point could be the stern gland and I'll dry it and watch it.
Think I need a whole day and night in the boat to find it and nail it.
It's a fibreglass hull but I have noticed in the bilge area a red/rusty colour in some parts of the floor paint. Not sure what that means but will confirm.

Thanks for your advice.

I had a Duncanson 26 years ago which leaked like yours. Unfortunately mine was intermittent. I sat looking for an hour with no sign of water. I'd leave the boat and come back a week later with water in the bilge. It was the stern gland. It filled a space away from the main bilge and then overflowed into the main bilge. Took ages to find it. Water in one part of the boat can be coming in a long way away.
MB has some rain leaks through various toe rail screws etc. Because they drip somewhere else, usually where your head is while trying to get some sleep at sea, they are hard to find and annoying.
Rain leaks won't sink it but salt water leaks will. Repair the leak, a pump is not the answer.

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MLCHereICOME said...
"It was the stern gland. It filled a space away from the main bilge and then overflowed into the main bilge."

This might be it MB. I can see water constantly in that stern gland area. Always a pool of water but I did not think it could overflow down into the bilge area. I pump it out of there manually once a month or so. There is a middle area under the Sole mini 14 engine where the water cascades first and from there it has to get over a wood slat separator and down into the main bilge area where the pump gets flogged and drains the battery. Yes you are right...fix the leak first.

It's (stern gland) is the only real through hull entry point for salt water so that could be it. Will check on the weekend.

Thanks mate.

regards

Where in Pittwater are you? MB is in Salt Pan Cove, if you are near we could meet up to see if we can sort it out.

The reason I asked about the motor is stern gland would say that it would be the first place to look.
Then through hull fittings if you have a log look at it.
Are you sure it is solid glass not glass over ply? As the ply can rot inside the glass layers.
You now have some ideas where to check

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MLCHereICOME said..
Hi Morning Bird, I think I have to get all the water out, dry it all with a towel and sit and watch it until I see the leak.
All sea cocks I turn off when I leave (engine cooling sea water, 2 for toilet). Only other entry point could be the stern gland and I'll dry it and watch it.
Think I need a whole day and night in the boat to find it and nail it.
It's a fibreglass hull but I have noticed in the bilge area a red/rusty colour in some parts of the floor paint. Not sure what that means but will confirm.

Thanks for your advice.

The seacocks can fail internally but there still should not be any leaks if you have rubber hose tails. If you have plastic hoses however you can have leaks as the plastic hardens and hose clamps can not tighten up.

The mould around the mast base could be from condensation. Salt water leaking in from the the stern gland evaporates and forms on the underside of the cabin as fresh water then drops down onto that timber bit as freshwater. If it was salt water it would not have mould.

I would wipe all the suspect areas dry and use talcum powder. I would also check the area behind the stern gland where it attaches to the stern tube, the stern tube may have corroded and the water is both sides of the tube. This depends on what style of stern gland set up you have and I can only presume its the original set up.

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Ramona said..

MLCHereICOME said..
Hi Morning Bird, I think I have to get all the water out, dry it all with a towel and sit and watch it until I see the leak.
All sea cocks I turn off when I leave (engine cooling sea water, 2 for toilet). Only other entry point could be the stern gland and I'll dry it and watch it.
Think I need a whole day and night in the boat to find it and nail it.
It's a fibreglass hull but I have noticed in the bilge area a red/rusty colour in some parts of the floor paint. Not sure what that means but will confirm.

Thanks for your advice.

The seacocks can fail internally but there still should not be any leaks if you have rubber hose tails. If you have plastic hoses however you can have leaks as the plastic hardens and hose clamps can not tighten up.

The mould around the mast base could be from condensation. Salt water leaking in from the the stern gland evaporates and forms on the underside of the cabin as fresh water then drops down onto that timber bit as freshwater. If it was salt water it would not have mould.

I would wipe all the suspect areas dry and use talcum powder. I would also check the area behind the stern gland where it attaches to the stern tube, the stern tube may have corroded and the water is both sides of the tube. This depends on what style of stern gland set up you have and I can only presume its the original set up.

Romana noted on all 3 points.

I think the middle point about the condensation from water coming in from stern gland might be part of the problem. I have seen water on the ceiling just above the mast and it drops down on the wood. Mind you that was when it was lightly raining but I double checked all around the mast entry point to cabin (on deck) and found no way the rain water could get in. I will check it.

Appreciate the tips.