Yeh soz about that to joe. Freeze is onto it.
I have known Sonia and Jason from near on 20 years now when we both started kiting. Honest as they come and they really take this kind of situation to heart.
consignment works but the benefit pretty much lies in the consumer. There is little the Fck all for retailer except wearing the financial cash flow risk. It's more of a community service they provide really but it moves gear usually to the right user
to spikemyhole... test that bar under load before you add anything else.
Geez didnt mean to start a flame war. Thanks for the name calling, real mature
Just wanting some input to see who was more right/less wrong in this situation.
I haveave never made any assertions about the character of the shop owners. I have had dealings with them in the past of the "I pay money, you give me gear" variety, and never had an issue as far as that goes. Never asked for any support in the past either. Have referred people there for lessons.
The bar was not my primary focus, and the shop had never asked me to test it... a bunch of feedback from the forums focuses on whether the bar is at fault or not... this is the kind of input I was after
In my years of kiting ive damaged and seen a number of kites damaged... never in such benign circumstances. Which made me feel something was not right with it, whether or not there is a fault with the bar
I will check the bar when i get home
So I checked the bar. Couldn't get it to release. So I guess that was my fault. Never happened to me before but I'll cop that on the chin.
So back to the original question... almost new kite pops after being hit by 1ft of whitewater after being used for 5 minutes. Suck it up or take it further?
Asking to work out what to do not to start a flame war
As an aside when I checked the bar there were 3 different line lengths from 4 lines... lol should have checked the tuning of the bar before I bought it too, only checked line condition. Lesson learned
Suck it up.
A consignment is not a merchant sale.
The shop did not accept legal title over the goods.
Consumer Law does not apply to private sales.
A hard lesson to learn.
Let's get a few fact straight here guys.......
I repaired this kite having been told of the situation. I was asked my thoughts as to why the damage had occurred by both Steve and WA Surf and said that it could have been due to a number of issues (most probably a line wrapped around the leading edge whilst flagged out) I also pointed out that the damage to the canopy looked as though something had scratched or rubbed as visible once it was put on my light-box and I'm almost sure that would have been noticed pre-purchase if it were there.
Also worth noting that although repair costs were $250 a chunk of the costs were incurred due to a previous repair by another repairer (which I believe was advertised) having been carried out poorly (in my opinion) and upon my recommendation Steve opted to have this re-done.
I agree with many of the above comments and knowing Jason and Sonya and how they go about running their business have to say that I'm certain this kite would not have been sold without a thorough prior inspection (the old repairs it was advertised with would probably have held out but were aesthetically poor).
Just a few points for all to digest
Ryan
The Sail Doctor
Kite and sail repairs
Correct Ryan fair play. There was a minor cosmetic repair included in that cost. From memory it was about 20 bucks worth.
I was sold the kite and told there was one past repair.... There was two large ones some pin holes and one or two open holes in the canopy .the open holes looked like they had been from a sketchy self launch... the one time I rode the kite I had someone launch me
Jason and Sonya I'm sorry if it's stressing you out. I'm not trying to ruin your business or anything. If that was the goal a couple of harsh Google or fb reviews would have done it.
I felt hard done by and wanted feedback whether I was in the wrong or not. Which is why I have not named name's or whinge about rip offs... I just want to find what's fair and do that. If consensus is that I should suck it up and move on so be it
I have learned a couple of things about buying second hand from shops.... go over everything with a fine tooth comb like you would with a private seller. Won't buy via post from a shop again unless the price justifies the risk. Don't expect too much in terms of after sale service.
Peace out I'm going to the beach
Steve
As an impartial bystander this was a more than acceptable topic for a post.
It is quite bizare that Eppo is allowed to get away with such a completely unacceptable level of insults and name calling.
Question for the mods, why is this behaviour tolerated ?
Hey spikey, just asking again, are you on a sliding rope or hook on your set up, cheers
Select to expand quoteWindWaterSailAU said..
As an impartial bystander this was a more than acceptable topic for a post.
It is quite bizare that Eppo is allowed to get away with such a completely unacceptable level of insults and name calling.
Question for the mods, why is this behaviour tolerated ?
Hmmmmm, a poignant question.
Imho when one reaches a status as profound as 'The Great One' Judgement occasionally becomes clouded.
The Ayatollah's outbursts defiantly need to be called to question.
I've got ur back Senor Eppo! More than happy to connect the size 9 steel cap with your rear end if need be.
Kind regards
Freeze
What's with the witch hunt.
I'm the one he called a tosser.
He apologized almost immediately.
All is forgiven
Move along folks, nothing to see here.
Select to expand quotepsychojoe said..
What's with the witch hunt.
I'm the one he called a tosser.
He apologized almost immediately.
All is forgiven
Move along folks, nothing to see here.
Hmmmmm, light banter Sir.
Been happening for years with the Messiah. To his credit he rarely responds in kind.
Select to expand quoteMrFreeze said..psychojoe said..
What's with the witch hunt.
I'm the one he called a tosser.
He apologized almost immediately.
All is forgiven
Move along folks, nothing to see here.
Hmmmmm, light banter Sir.
Been happening for years with the Messiah. To his credit he rarely responds in kind.
Freeze...Your as cold as ice, someday you'll pay the price, I know. I've seen it before, it happens all the time.
A little too late but Well done Steve checking the bar. Interesting observations by Ryan.
I'm not to sure what my occupation has to do with anything stamp. Easy target and simple flippant comment to make I suppose. Grow an imagination maybe someday mate as private and work life are two very seperate things. You are men and should be able to handle some banter without crying about moderation nor about someone occupation. Weak as piss. Grow a pair.
I am a loyal sod and don't like to see good people who have been committed to this sport well beyond any of us keyboard jokers having their credibility questioned. The insults ... ya right serve no purpose.
and this credibility is still being questioned Steve with your passive aggressive concluding statement "Won't buy via post from a shop again unless the price justifies the risk. Don't expect too much in terms of after sale service."
for years I've had J and S bend over backwards with so called "after sales service" ... well above and beyond what you would expect. And now the same with my son and the crew I sail with. I presume none of you were at the kite carnival at the pond last week, because you wouldn't be questioning their hard work and commitment then.
the logical step after your incident would have been to check the bar (you don't need the shop to tell you this). Then come to the obvious conclusion that you kooked it up.
not get on the net and post what you did.
so mr 22 post windwatersailau, it was not an acceptable topic to post. Not until some facts were ascertained. Someones reputation and livelihood was being questioned without due diligence
so regardless I'm happy to have crew question my conduct if that means it deflects the incorrect focus on J and S credibility
which Steve is exactly what was going to happen with your post here or on Facebook/ google. So you kooked up your kite and then whinged like a spoiled child on the net. Good on ya.
Select to expand quoteeppo said..
A little too late but Well done Steve checking the bar. Interesting observations by Ryan.
Up
I'm not to sure what my occupation has to do with anything stamp. Easy target and simple flippant comment to make I suppose. Grow an imagination maybe someday mate.
I am a loyal sod and don't like to see good people who have been committed to this sport well beyond any of us keyboard jokers having their credibility questioned. The insults ... ya right serve no purpose.
and this credibility is still being questioned Steve with your passive aggressive concluding statement "Won't buy via post from a shop again unless the price justifies the risk. Don't expect too much in terms of after sale service."
for years .....blah blah blah
Obviously, if the kite really has that many holes they could have contributed to the failure of the kite, maybe leave the shop out of it and approach the previous owner to cover some of the repair cost.
On a side note, Eppos up to his belt in every shops ass and has no credibility, seen this time and time again, his postings have become more aggressive towards the recipient, this is the sort of guy who will kick you in the teeth while your down. Poor character dude
Select to expand quotelistery said..MrFreeze said..psychojoe said..
What's with the witch hunt.
I'm the one he called a tosser.
He apologized almost immediately.
All is forgiven
Move along folks, nothing to see here.
Hmmmmm, light banter Sir.
Been happening for years with the Messiah. To his credit he rarely responds in kind.
Freeze...Your as cold as ice, someday you'll pay the price, I know. I've seen it before, it happens all the time.
Hmmmmm, started off well, rhyming and funny. Can't help feeling you've plagiarised some song lyrics.
Anyway, as deep as your comments have cut me I'll attempt to curtail my sarcasm.
Select to expand quotepsychojoe said..
Wow. What a load of **** from Beebee and Beelzebub. Sounds like they own the shop. When somebody traded in their old kite, as professionals the shop inspected it, valued it, marked down for any repairs needed and a reasonable profit. The shop took that chance, not you.
I do not have any association with any shop, although I did purchase a used kite from WestOz. Good kite, good price, and still flying flawlessly after 5 years.
Select to expand quoteBeelzebub said..psychojoe said..
Wow. What a load of **** from Beebee and Beelzebub. Sounds like they own the shop. When somebody traded in their old kite, as professionals the shop inspected it, valued it, marked down for any repairs needed and a reasonable profit. The shop took that chance, not you.
I do not have any association with any shop, although I did purchase a used kite from WestOz. Good kite, good price, and still flying flawlessly after 5 years.
Yeah, all the early comments are out of context now that we know it was a consignment, not a merchant sale.
Sorry about that.
The reo - most fragile kite I have seen. Some local crew have them, and I have witnessed the popped bladder from a minor run through the rinse cycle in an innocuous shore break on two occasions. Have also seen the ripped canopy from flagging line damage to reo. Nice flying kites, but they seem fragile.
Eppo bought a second hand 12 inch dildo online from some bloke called the doctor
When he measured it , it was only 9 inches
Previouse owner blamed general wear n tear, you wouldn't argue about that one
Select to expand quotecauncy said..
Eppo bought a second hand 12 inch dildo online from some bloke called the doctor
When he measured it , it was only 9 inches
Previouse owner blamed general wear n tear, you wouldn't argue about that one
Hmmmmm, now come on, you're baiting the great one.
Even the average Joe knows the Ayatollah of Rock and Rolla's religion forbids him from using such aids, however, in hindsight his recent behavior could be due to someone smacking him around the chops with one. Therefore some type of interaction with said device could have occurred.
...just want to point out that not all Steve's who kitesurf behave like this spikey Kook.
i bought a NOS kite (from one of the other local shops - I like to support all of them as equally as I can) first time I took her out she popped her bladder too. TFUP.
Kites can get repaired without the drama (thanks Ryan great service) but reputations and business' aren't so easy to fix up.
I don't usually say or post much, but on behalf of all the other Steve's, can you please change your name?
Select to expand quotestillsendingit said..
...just want to point out that not all Steve's who kitesurf behave like this spikey Kook.
i bought a NOS kite (from one of the other local shops - I like to support all of them as equally as I can) first time I took her out she popped her bladder too. TFUP.
Kites can get repaired without the drama (thanks Ryan great service) but reputations and business' aren't so easy to fix up.
I don't usually say or post much, but on behalf of all the other Steve's, can you please change your name?
Hmmmmm, there are businesses that sell products and spruik them as the greatest thing since slice bread until they flick the brand, then proceed to bag the hell out of the same brand they once sold.
Some real hypocrites in the retail game.
Pardon me for trolling guys, but this thread has given me much hope in SBRZ's antics in general. It reminded me of the good old days of which I now wear my "Lofty bruses" with pride, and thanks for keeping it real!
ps. I won't name and shame but I got shafted from a shop in QLD once. Had to repair all the valves myself in the end, as it was falsely advertised as fully holding air!! #&*#^%#%^
Select to expand quotestillsendingit said..
...just want to point out that not all Steve's who kitesurf behave like this spikey Kook.
i bought a NOS kite (from one of the other local shops - I like to support all of them as equally as I can) first time I took her out she popped her bladder too. TFUP.
Kites can get repaired without the drama (thanks Ryan great service) but reputations and business' aren't so easy to fix up.
I don't usually say or post much, but on behalf of all the other Steve's, can you please change your name?
I think what's been lost on a few people reading this thread, is that Spikeysteve didn't name anyone at any stage. He literally just asked for advice.
Another point to note: Ryan assessed the kite during repair and noted that kite fabric was damaged, probably due to a wrapped line, he also said he thought it would have been noticeable before bladder blew out if it happened before the incident. I don't think shop should be responsible for half of full repair which included improvements to a previous "dodgy" repair, Steve should have inspected the kite before forking over a grand of his hard earned dollars. Since there is no proof the damage to the fabric happened before or during the incident, some may say it's fair to share the cost of the bladder repair portion of the invoice but definitely not fixing previous dodgy repairs.Here are my thoughts on consignment: I'm in favour of consignment and this is my understanding of how it works:
Seller has a kite they want to upgrade or sell so they drop it off at a shop, experienced shop staff pump up kite, give it a fair value based on their experience and current prices for same 2nd hand kite of similar age/condition on various "for sale" sites. Let's say the kite is valued at $1000The seller now has 4 options:
1) List kite themselves at full value, cop the advertising costs, take photos, answer incoming calls etc and wait for it to sell to get their money (less cost, time etc)2) Trade kite on new gear and get $500 credit towards new purchase (Shop has to wait till old kite sells before getting their money and deserve the 50% markup)
3) Leave kite on consignment and get $850 shop credit towards new gear once the kite sells (shop makes 15% margin for their time and advertising costs)
4) Leave kite on consignment and get $750 CASH from shop once it sells (shop makes an extra 10% since they are not making any profit on a new sale)
Just my two cents worth, advantages of buying a kite on consignment, particularly for a newbie, is that the kite has been inspected by an experienced kiter and given a fair value they can trust rather than getting ripped off because they don't know how to assess gear yet.
Have fun with the replies, cheers.
Select to expand quoteWindWaterSailAU said..
Question for the mods, why is this behaviour tolerated ?
The answer is nobody reported it, so mods were unaware.
Just like the police can't see every offence, by everybody, all the time, the mods can't read every post, by everybody, all the time.
If you find something offensive, click the red flag above the post and report it.
Insults and name calling are the Australian way of our vernacular it isn't always a personal attack.
Sometimes it's actually a friendly greeting lol.
Crap happens that's life period.
How you deal with it shows what sort of intestinal fortitude you have.
And threatening someone's business is definitely not the way to go.
And if you think a social media campaign would achieve that you are delusional.
Unless you are a superstar with a million followers.
Cop it on the chin.
And Laurie and his mods are onto posts believe me.
I had a post shut down by supplying true facts.
Which I still believe that too the contary it gave knowledge so kiters wouldn't make assumptions about shop owners becoming rich from selling kites.
And a lot worse insults has been spilled on here previously.
Glad it's finally sorted out.
I can't believe that a 2nd hand kite with bar for 1k could upset someone so much.
A bar is 800 plus?
So you got a bargain.
Select to expand quotespikeysteve said..
Hi breezers need some input about where to go next with this...
Ive been kiting almost 10 yrs, riding reos since the first generation. surfing for 30 yearsLast year I bought some second hand gear off a shop I have bought gear off before... Ozone Reo V4 w bar and lines - not new but pretty close to it.
First time I take it out, (a small day at Trigg) I tack out the back, and the first time the kite goes above 12 the bar releases itself, and the kite flags on the safety. after a few minutes of stuffing around, i can get the chicken loop back in, so I do a deep water pack down on the lines and use the kite to drag myself in. As i get closer in, I can stand so i grab the kite by the leading edge, get hit by 1ft of whitewater from a broken wave, and the leading edge bursts.
My ozone flagged out unexpectedly a couple of weeks ago, chicken loop slipped off hook, swam to bar, reconnected chicken loop and relaunched, body dragged back to board, all good.
User error, keen to get out and didn't insert the donkey dick properly, second time I've done this summer 
