Select to expand quotemikedk said..
Technique is in fact my priority, I do the best I can on this front :) but my old Naish Ride doesn't really help in learning kite loops. Anyways, I need to update my quiver, so why not getting a more playful kite...
Im not sure they are one in the same. My investigation and trialing of late has me thinking playful = less boost potential, heavier more stable slower to 12 equals more boost.
Happy for someone who knows what they are talking about to come over the top of me on this as its all part of learning.
My demo of XR4 had me straight away thinking, this is a serious kite. heaps of boost and float, but didn't have that on off throttle feeling the Dice has. If I launched on the XR4 even not edging well or sending it quite as good as it should I still got pretty good height and float by my standards.
The dice and RPms Ive flown on the other hand just felt fun fast and great for just doing what ever. They can still jump and float well but in that regard you have to be more technically correct to get the result. Does sound a bit of a contradiction putting fun and more technical in same sentence but that's the vibe for me!
Naish Pivot is a good option. Personally I preferred it over Rebel, Xr4, Boost 2, or Edge.
Select to expand quotebjw said..
I reckon they should ban people from recommending the kite brand they currently own.
Otherwise it's like inviting a pimp into your wife's bed.
People try different kites and end up buying what they liked best. Nothing wrong with recommending what you own provided you tried other kites in the same category.
This chic just out jumped and looped 99.9% of all Seabreeze Keyboarding warriors haa haa Perhaps ask her what she rides.. 
Select to expand quoteSwavek said..
People try different kites and end up buying what they liked best. Nothing wrong with recommending what you own provided you tried other kites in the same category.
I actually think most people don't demo before they buy, and if they do then they demo one brand, especially as most shops don't have a range of brands. Plus a lot of crew buy online.
Select to expand quotebjw said..Swavek said..
People try different kites and end up buying what they liked best. Nothing wrong with recommending what you own provided you tried other kites in the same category.
I actually think most people don't demo before they buy, and if they do then they demo one brand, especially as most shops don't have a range of brands. Plus a lot of crew buy online.
Its definitely not easy to demo diff styles of kite, speaking from my recent efforts on east coast.
Select to expand quoteSaveTheWhales said..
This chic just out jumped and looped 99.9% of all Seabreeze Keyboarding warriors haa haa Perhaps ask her what she rides..
Is she on a Buzz kite.
Select to expand quoteRichoa said..bjw said..Swavek said..
People try different kites and end up buying what they liked best. Nothing wrong with recommending what you own provided you tried other kites in the same category.
I actually think most people don't demo before they buy, and if they do then they demo one brand, especially as most shops don't have a range of brands. Plus a lot of crew buy online.
Its definitely not easy to demo diff styles of kite, speaking from my recent efforts on east coast.
True, took me a few months to try a few models I wanted to try.
Certainly give the new EnduroV2 a run, coming from early C kites then high aspect and back to modern C kites I'm loving this kite, powerful , jumps really well, lovely connected feel all through the gears, great float, been having a ball in average shore breaks, loops smooth with a nice kick as it comes around, with 3 custom settings , wave, freeride, freestyle, wich you certainly feel, fave for me is freeride/ short backline when we've some waves or freestyle short. backline when it's cranking, both on fast tip setting, was banging out some massive airs on the 10 in 25 knts last night, this style of kite was on my list this season, others were gts4, bandit, evo,
Select to expand quoteGazuki said..
Buzz.
Actually got some decent jumps in on the buzz9 in standard winds, all rounder too, I've flown a lot worse feeling kites from big brands
C kite with right technique brings you up highest but drops you like a rock too. But the speed and ability to actively fly and throw precisely as your input is 100% converted into action is gold.
Delta kites in larger sizes see you travelling a long distance at crap height. In smaller sizes with nuking wind a small size Rebel or similar would probably outperform any C kite in terms of height from my experience.
Best compromise throughout all sizes and all winds are some of the hybrid C kites e.g. Enduro. As they mix the advantages of the above. Most riders will be able to achieve good things on those kites, and it's best value for money as they are capable of performing in all disciplines pretty well (wave, flat, chop, boost, basic level trickery).
And then there are differences between brands and types of kites aiming at that segment.
Personally I feel that pulleys make kites less direct hence spoil the fun for advanced riders, but make it easier to handle and safer and more comfortable in gusts for the average rider.
Outside of above bandwith there are some experienced riders doing great things on kites outside of what these kites are aiming at, as it suits their specific needs. And that's perfectly fine but confusing for the majority of riders.
Just ride what suits you most and work on the technique. Enjoy along the way.
Pulleys or no pulleys is irrelevant. Flown plenty of pulleyless kites that aren't direct and vice versa. A lot more involved than just pulleys or not. Be nice if it was that simple. With pulleyless kites the canopy has to do a lot of work to change angle of attack, that can create a super sloppy "fly off the front line" feel.
But hey hey if it makes you
feel bette inside about your purchases and ideas then go for it.
I do agree, hybrid C is the best compromise.
Select to expand quoteeppo said..
Pulleys or no pulleys is irrelevant. Flown plenty of pulleyless kites that aren't direct and vice versa. A lot more involved than just pulleys or not. Be nice if it was that simple. With pulleyless kites the canopy has to do a lot of work to change angle of attack, that can create a super sloppy "fly off the front line" feel.
But hey hey if it makes you
feel bette inside about your purchases and ideas then go for it.
I do agree, hybrid C is the best compromise.
Yes it was a generalisation mate and I agree about the potential challenges a simplistic kite design comes with. But I'd rather work around that then having silly bits and pieces on the kite requiring replacement and shortening the lifetime of the lines too.
Guess my point was more about the kite type and that there is no such one kite or kite category making you go huge. And that kite size i.e. wind strength may make you choose a very different kite. Seabreeze users from over East probably fly more 10-12m kites and even larger at times while WA main kites would be in the 7-10m range. WA wind is heaps more consistent and strong, hence choice of kite is different.
Anyway, complex topic. Just try and find what works best for you for what you are trying to achieve, in your conditions, suss the kite out, and work on technique.
North Vegas !!! 10m in 28- 33 knots. Animal kite like an r1 or cr 500. I got a rebel 9m more like a nice Honda bross 250. Does what you want when you want great for jumping **** for loops. Had a shot of my mates evo in 25knots on New Years what a kite will be looking at a quiver of evos this coming winter season they are like a mix of all. Fly one !!!
Select to expand quoteRussKraut said..
having silly bits and pieces on the kite requiring replacement and shortening the lifetime of the lines too
Have you ever replaced pulleys?
I've got 8-year-old kites with pulleys that have never had pulley or bridle lines replaced (not Flysurfer by the way). I'm more worried about the canopy falling apart from so much use.
Select to expand quoteTHE PIN PULLER said..
North Vegas !!! 10m in 28- 33 knots. Animal kite like an r1 or cr 500. I got a rebel 9m more like a nice Honda bross 250. Does what you want when you want great for jumping **** for loops. Had a shot of my mates evo in 25knots on New Years what a kite will be looking at a quiver of evos this coming winter season they are like a mix of all. Fly one !!!
What year evo did you try?
Select to expand quoteKamikuza said..RussKraut said..
having silly bits and pieces on the kite requiring replacement and shortening the lifetime of the lines too
Have you ever replaced pulleys?
I've got 8-year-old kites with pulleys that have never had pulley or bridle lines replaced (not Flysurfer by the way). I'm more worried about the canopy falling apart from so much use.
Good for you. SS RPM don't remember the year, recall of pulleys even, we had to get sliders instead. They have then in 2015 eliminated pulleys altogether.
Core Riot XR. Pulleys chewed away bridle lines making them fluffy and thicker looking. Line snapped during a jump, leading to death loops once I was back in/under water. Kite and lines were in their third season.
I then moved away from pulleys so can't give you more recent examples.
Select to expand quoteRichoa said..bjw said..Swavek said..
People try different kites and end up buying what they liked best. Nothing wrong with recommending what you own provided you tried other kites in the same category.
I actually think most people don't demo before they buy, and if they do then they demo one brand, especially as most shops don't have a range of brands. Plus a lot of crew buy online.
Its definitely not easy to demo diff styles of kite, speaking from my recent efforts on east coast.
Demo then expect to pay full retail. Return the kite not having tried it in a variety of wind conditions and riding styles.
Plenty of second handies to buy and try out see if it suits your riding style.
Select to expand quoteRussKraut said..Kamikuza said..RussKraut said..
having silly bits and pieces on the kite requiring replacement and shortening the lifetime of the lines too
Have you ever replaced pulleys?
I've got 8-year-old kites with pulleys that have never had pulley or bridle lines replaced (not Flysurfer by the way). I'm more worried about the canopy falling apart from so much use.
Good for you. SS RPM don't remember the year, recall of pulleys even, we had to get sliders instead. They have then in 2015 eliminated pulleys altogether.
Core Riot XR. Pulleys chewed away bridle lines making them fluffy and thicker looking. Line snapped during a jump, leading to death loops once I was back in/under water. Kite and lines were in their third season.
I then moved away from pulleys so can't give you more recent examples.
The RPMs with pulleys I've seen have all used the same ****ty Ronstan ones that FS uses. They fall apart on a regular basis, good thing they're cheap I guess.
Shouldn't be using bare Dyneema for bridles anyway.
So ok I'll concede that ****ty design and cheap parts can and do lead to failure.
I guess when I think of pulleys I tend to think of Cabrinha and they've been that right for years. Shame the new bars aren't up to the same standards 
Caveat emptor as always. I retract my blanket statement that there's nothing wrong with pulleys 
I have a vested interest and a biased opinion, so best you try one and form your own opinion on it.
Gen7 Ocean Rodeo Razor, OR have done a great job refining this kite this season.
It still rips you off the water, big windrange, fast and responsive but has a bit more hangtime and more unhooked line slack in the freestyle setting. It has one pulley on the bridal.
Won't suit everyone - but I've been getting very good feedback on this kite.
Loops good - WA rider TooLateMate taking it out for a spin -
Wow that is great video for showing off the kite. You can actually see how responsive and predictable it is. It obviously helps having a good rider but man that thong just looks good in the air.
Haven't heard much about the new switch element which would fit the criteria of this thread. Anyone who can actually ride been on one ?
Here's a good vid of E6 showing its stuff - Looks impressive. and plenty of kite movement visuals...
5 struts , unusual in today's 3 strut kite driven market, Felix pavek and mark Jacobs make a tarpaulin fly well
Select to expand quoteSaveTheWhales said..
Here's a good vid of E6 showing its stuff - Looks impressive. and plenty of kite movement visuals...
Bad of them to say bomb proof ? All the awl lads down my local have them I think due to cost. They have all been whining about the canopy wearing out where the leading edge touches it, I think they all went back for warranty.
They go nowhere near as good in my opinion.
The evo I tried is a 2016 it's the same hook up as my Vegas / Rebel no pulleys just straight on no kissing type set up.
I have a brand new E6 9 meter and Controller 4 sitting here, haven't had a puff of wind since they arrived a few weeks ago. I flew the prototype, reminded me of a Wainman but better. A smooth, fast turning kite that also has great hang time. Whenever the wind comes back I'll get a detailed review going.
Select to expand quoteTHE PIN PULLER said..SaveTheWhales said..
Here's a good vid of E6 showing its stuff - Looks impressive. and plenty of kite movement visuals...
Bad of them to say bomb proof ? All the awl lads down my local have them I think due to cost. They have all been whining about the canopy wearing out where the leading edge touches it, I think they all went back for warranty.
They go nowhere near as good in my opinion.
The evo I tried is a 2016 it's the same hook up as my Vegas / Rebel no pulleys just straight on no kissing type set up.
Yes the 2016 Evo (and 2017) is / WAS a superb all around type kite, more leaning towards the bump and jump TT style end of the spectrum. But it does okay in the waves and on SB's etc.
Pin Puller try and get on a 2018 evo if you can. Because I seem to one of the few people commenting on how horribly sh1t it is. Flying Vegas's and rebels you may understand what I've been trying to say, but no one seems to be listening... oh and try a 2018 rebel, you will love that to 
(but apparently that is also much better than ever before....BULLSH1T!!).
Select to expand quoteTHE PIN PULLER said..
North Vegas !!! 10m in 28- 33 knots. Animal kite like an r1 or cr 500. I got a rebel 9m more like a nice Honda bross 250. Does what you want when you want great for jumping **** for loops. Had a shot of my mates evo in 25knots on New Years what a kite will be looking at a quiver of evos this coming winter season they are like a mix of all. Fly one !!!
Nice, the 9 was my fave, the v2 enduro on freestyle/ fast/ short backline has a very similar feel but more umphhhhhhhhh, I'm jumping a bit bigger than the Vegas 2013/14 on the enduro v2 with the added advantage of changing the settings to freeride n wave,
There is no better kite on the market better in Floaty jumps than the Ozone Edge and better than that is the Flysurfer Boost2
