High speed rail? A second harbour bridge? A new city in the middle of nowhere? What infrastructure projects would be good if we had the money to build it, but still had to pay its own way at some point in time?
This is not political, but just a discussion about what projects Australia can benefit from. If we make it political it will just get moved into heavy weather, but I am interested in hearing different opinions. Everyone has an idea of what they think will work.
Me, I think a high-speed rail between Melbourne, Canberra, Sydney, and Brisbane would be good, but I wonder if it would be justified? I am still surprised that rail transport doesn't seem to take that much freight off of the roads, but it seems it doesn't.
Bulldoze Parliment building Canberra ...
Its not needed , States can run themselves .
on a more serious note , the GREAT Central Highway seal it , for those that don't know it its a graded track that passes from Western QLD , through Alice NT , and arrives at Laverton WA .
High speed rail makes no economic sense in Australia. Putting money into developing clean ways to power jets does.
A hyperloop might be cheap enough to work, but it comes up against the same land acquisition expense as HSR would, which I think is a big fraction of the cost.
I'd vote for distributed energy storage facilities, pumped hydro, compressed air, hydrogen, even batteries, and the electricity network upgrade to support them. It's mildly amusing that Slomo is wanting to push the 2nd Bass Strait DC interconnector. It is reported that it only makes sense if coal plants close down, and the Libs hate that prospect. Is he trying to grab Labor and Greens votes?
Select to expand quoteMr Milk said..
High speed rail makes no economic sense in Australia. Putting money into developing clean ways to power jets does.
A hyperloop might be cheap enough to work, but it comes up against the same land acquisition expense as HSR would, which I think is a big fraction of the cost.
I'd vote for distributed energy storage facilities, pumped hydro, compressed air, hydrogen, even batteries, and the electricity network upgrade to support them. It's mildly amusing that Slomo is wanting to push the 2nd Bass Strait DC interconnector. It is reported that it only makes sense if coal plants close down, and the Libs hate that prospect. Is he trying to grab Labor and Greens votes?
Yeah, I tend to agree about the high speed rail thing. Planes are cheap and are already there and can vary based on demand.
But I wonder if there are other hidden benefits of such a thing? Could you stimulate housing in otherwise not so good areas because you linked it to another capital with high speed rail?
If there were a high speed link from a single point to an existing capital, would you move there if it only took 30mins to get to the capital 100kms away?
What are the jobs though that will bring the most benefit to the economy in keeping the maximum number of people employed versus the best economic outcome? Sure, it is nice to save money, but right now are we after ways to get people happy and spending or something else?
What is out there that provides more jobs and does it quickly?
I don't like it when big jobs are created and only one supplier can really compete for it, and then there are jobs but they are all in one place. Is this better than lots of smaller jobs? I don't know.
1 Gas fired power stations, cheapest power we can do and integrate solar and wind into the system.
2 Scrap the NBN and put fiber to ever house and business.
3 Build more dams and whatever other water storage or water catchment systems are viable.
4 Hi speed rail between east coast majors. Trains can run to the second and are not weather dependent and will open up corridors of development between the cities.
The other problem with HSR is the lack of redundancy in the system. One broken down or derailed train and everything stops.
Jet travel has a bit of a problem with weather, but in the very worst cases planes can land at other airports
Select to expand quoteHardcarve1 said..
1 Gas fired power stations, cheapest power we can do and integrate solar and wind into the system.
2 Scrap the NBN and put fiber to ever house and business.
3 Build more dams and whatever other water storage or water catchment systems are viable.
4 Hi speed rail between east coast majors. Trains can run to the second and are not weather dependent and will open up corridors of development between the cities.
not cheap , basically a jet engine driving a turbine , have to be pulled apart and refurbished like any motor , plus gas is finite ... wind solar batteries is the future .
Nuclear waste dumb that takes overseas waste, we charge massive amounts upfront and massive ongoing fees too.
Enough nuclear power plants with uranium sourced locally providing free power to all homes and Australian owned businesses. Funded by the nuclear waste money.
I guess we don't even need to validate ideas, as people don't do this when voting. They just vote on what sounds good to them.
Bradfield scheme? Sure.
High speed rail? Sure.
Coffee baristas on every street corner? Sure.
Put together a super team of scientists, researchers, anyone give them money and time and tell them to eradicate cancer, covid etc.
Select to expand quotelog man said..
Put together a super team of scientists, researchers, anyone give them money and time and tell them to eradicate cancer, covid etc.
I wouldn't vote for that. It would be an endless money pit and not guaranteed outcome.
I think we can already see that trying to get a vaccine for Covid19 is challenging as everyone wants to be the first to make profits, but not many want to be second, so who risks that development money?
Darwin to Melbourne high speed maglev freight line passing through the heartlands.
Reduces ship turn around time from 6 weeks to 6 days and eliminates much shipping from travelling inside the GBR.
Decentralised grid with renewable power and battery/ pumped hydro backup. A real internet system.
Renewable power export industry, hydrogen ( ammonia)
Wave pools scattered around the country. Like the urbansurf in Melbourne...Cheaper than an AFL stadium...
The Brisbane to Sydney to Melbourne air corridor is the second busiest air corridor in the world.
High speed rail makes economic sense with that fact .
And it would create a lot of jobs .
a water pipeline from the Ord river and FNQ to top up river systems that are being run dry by overfarming.
A massive investment into Indigenous farming practices where we grow and harvest sustainable crops that enhance the land and not just pillage (for want of a better word) them. It is possible to have an Australian cuisine that doesn't consist of meat pies and pavlovas. We have grain crops that are drought resistant, we have wild yams that used to grow in abundance before the invasion, we have some of the lowest fat meat (Kangaroo, Crocodile) available in the world that we can not only use ourselves but we can export this so much better all over the world. There is no reason why some enterprising entrepreneur could not team up with a celebrity chef to farm purely Australian produce and livestock and make a truly Australian cuisine.
Who should the money go to? which plays a big part in what can be done. If its big infrastructure then the big business get it, pays no tax and money is channelled into executive salaries and profits. Big business is also only interested in share holders which is not a bad thing but it doesn't mean they care how the money is spent in the community. Which level of government would give the best outcome for the average person to not only get benefits from it but may be get a finger in the pie. Would local councils be the best spenders to reach us but at the expense of not having the best outcome for nation building.
I just don't want to see big corporates like Lend Lease who pay no tax get their hands on this money.
Mandatory aged care facilities for boomers... housing solved...
Training and education for people for care of boomers... to ensure they can't escape... jobs...
Hmmm... what to do with the debt? Hmmm... ah, yes, sell Melbourne. #sellmel.
Better and safer road systems throughout the country with no more high speed two way roads .
Select to expand quoteactiomax said..
The Brisbane to Sydney to Melbourne air corridor is the second busiest air corridor in the world.
High speed rail makes economic sense with that fact .
And it would create a lot of jobs .
At $100B+? Say 10 000 passengers a day each way. That's way more than current traffic. It would be close to 400 flights each way. 3 million trips a year. Capital embedded into each trip is about $30 000, if you write it off over a year. OK, you write it off over 50 years, so each ticket costs $600 return plus running costs.
The second Sydney airport makes sense, at a couple of $B, because it allows more take offs and landings. Once you're in the air the planes can fly in a corridor 100km wide. And it has created jobs where people actually live in Western Sydney, not in an ever relocating construction camp.
we should get into building cars in Aus, maybe call the factory holdorf or forden, 100% aus built and sold around the world.
Oh wait, we tried that already and we are left with 1000s of workers jobless.
Select to expand quotesick_em_rex said..
a water pipeline from the Ord river and FNQ to top up river systems that are being run dry by overfarming.
A massive investment into Indigenous farming practices where we grow and harvest sustainable crops that enhance the land and not just pillage (for want of a better word) them. It is possible to have an Australian cuisine that doesn't consist of meat pies and pavlovas. We have grain crops that are drought resistant, we have wild yams that used to grow in abundance before the invasion, we have some of the lowest fat meat (Kangaroo, Crocodile) available in the world that we can not only use ourselves but we can export this so much better all over the world. There is no reason why some enterprising entrepreneur could not team up with a celebrity chef to farm purely Australian produce and livestock and make a truly Australian cuisine.
Not sure about the pipeline but the second part sounds a great part of the solution.
I would get rid of unemployment benefits, provide a universal basic income but you have to work for it.
Not demeaning clean up other peoples mess jobs but things that make a difference.
Things like sick em rex is suggesting.
The additional money that everyone gets will be spent back into our local economies making us far stronger and less reliant on trade.
Select to expand quoteTonyAbbott said..
Nuclear waste dumb that takes overseas waste, we charge massive amounts upfront and massive ongoing fees too.
Enough nuclear power plants with uranium sourced locally providing free power to all homes and Australian owned businesses. Funded by the nuclear waste money.
stop making sense tony....
Select to expand quoteratz said..TonyAbbott said..
Nuclear waste dumb that takes overseas waste, we charge massive amounts upfront and massive ongoing fees too.
Enough nuclear power plants with uranium sourced locally providing free power to all homes and Australian owned businesses. Funded by the nuclear waste money.
stop making sense tony....
And then what? Once we all get a healthy green glow and bucket loads of stuff that stays very bad for anything alive for a very long time .we flush it down the toilet and say well that's that then?
It seems short sighted to me. I'm dumb maybe not ???
Seems dumb.
Select to expand quotesick_em_rex said..
a water pipeline from the Ord river and FNQ to top up river systems that are being run dry by overfarming.
A massive investment into Indigenous farming practices where we grow and harvest sustainable crops that enhance the land and not just pillage (for want of a better word) them. It is possible to have an Australian cuisine that doesn't consist of meat pies and pavlovas. We have grain crops that are drought resistant, we have wild yams that used to grow in abundance before the invasion, we have some of the lowest fat meat (Kangaroo, Crocodile) available in the world that we can not only use ourselves but we can export this so much better all over the world. There is no reason why some enterprising entrepreneur could not team up with a celebrity chef to farm purely Australian produce and livestock and make a truly Australian cuisine.
#meatpiesmatter
#footypiesmatter
Select to expand quoteTonyAbbott said..sick_em_rex said..
a water pipeline from the Ord river and FNQ to top up river systems that are being run dry by overfarming.
A massive investment into Indigenous farming practices where we grow and harvest sustainable crops that enhance the land and not just pillage (for want of a better word) them. It is possible to have an Australian cuisine that doesn't consist of meat pies and pavlovas. We have grain crops that are drought resistant, we have wild yams that used to grow in abundance before the invasion, we have some of the lowest fat meat (Kangaroo, Crocodile) available in the world that we can not only use ourselves but we can export this so much better all over the world. There is no reason why some enterprising entrepreneur could not team up with a celebrity chef to farm purely Australian produce and livestock and make a truly Australian cuisine.
#meatpiesmatter
#footypiesmatter
Bratwursts matter ! The local smalgoods joint has changed the recipe, and I won't stand for it!
they where exceptionally good! Now .... average ??
Select to expand quotestupid said..ratz said..TonyAbbott said..
Nuclear waste dumb that takes overseas waste, we charge massive amounts upfront and massive ongoing fees too.
Enough nuclear power plants with uranium sourced locally providing free power to all homes and Australian owned businesses. Funded by the nuclear waste money.
stop making sense tony....
And then what? Once we all get a healthy green glow and bucket loads of stuff that stays very bad for anything alive for a very long time .we flush it down the toilet and say well that's that then?
It seems short sighted to me. I'm dumb maybe not ???
Seems dumb.
If you had any idea how much and what chemicals are pumped into mines and mine sites you wouldnt blink an eye.
When you have a constant procession of road trains from Adelaide 24/7 carrying chemicals for these mines
Tony Ablett makes sense
