Doutone flip

Don't fall in?

Flipping wings, sails is part of it, don't figjt it, learn how to use the wind.

I have a 5m Unit that is my main wing. I like it and flipping upside down is not a big deal for me as:

I hang on to the wing when I fall.

When in the water and trying to get the board into position, I hold the leash down to prevent flipping.

When climbing up the board, I press down on the wing which also helps with balancing.

In the odd case of the wing flipping up side down, I flip it over while I am in the water, keeping the board in control with foil under water.

I am only learning on a SUP with no foil. I was out in 25knt gusts with my 5m V1 and I felt like it was trying to attack me. When it was blowing the thing was jumping violently up and down 3 or 4 feet. Hit the water then jump up and then back down. It would do this until I could get control. I suppose the trick is to stay in control somehow. Anyway it is for sale now. It likes to flip as well.

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eppo said..

The flatter wings like My ppc for sure have less tendency to flip. Can't argue against that point. But you learn to manage it and changing wings won't make you a better at it in the end.

Hey eppo.
I'm very interested in the PPC wing.
Comparing the unit to the PPC wing, how does the low end grunt compare.
And the overall weight between the two?

I'm very used to the weight & low end grunt of the A wing as comparison...but enjoy the light handling of the unit...

Would appreciate your thoughts!

i use the Unit a lot and have never noticed it's being predisposed to flip. The original Duotone Foil Wing had more of this character, but I've noticed less in the Echo and almost none in the Unit. Some of this natural rolling is good/OK IMO. I find too stable a wing (with zero roll) is harder to tack (Slingwing v2, Swing), while other wings that are stable drifters but still have a little roll in them like the BRM, Unit, Wasp are much more natural to tack.

Anybody else notice this?

YMMV

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Goofcat said..
Recently got a Unit 4m and noticed an annoying thing about it. The darn thing likes to be upside down! Every time I fall, the thing flips upside down. I've come to learn that this is call the "Doutone flip". Is there a cure for this? If not I'm going to get rid of the wing.

You might be disappointed if you ditch the wing for that reason....I've found they all do it and I don't consider it a bad thing. My Cabrinha flies beautifully upside down and is less draggy when doing so. I just reel it in, flip over and start again.Added bonus: when mine starts hovering upside down, I know there's enough wind to get up on the foil.

I have a duotone v1 5m I find even walking on the beach it's a handful tilting side to side and trying to roll

I have both the unit and the echo. Not spending a penny on duotone wings again

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longboard said..

eppo said..

The flatter wings like My ppc for sure have less tendency to flip. Can't argue against that point. But you learn to manage it and changing wings won't make you a better at it in the end.

Hey eppo.
I'm very interested in the PPC wing.
Comparing the unit to the PPC wing, how does the low end grunt compare.
And the overall weight between the two?

I'm very used to the weight & low end grunt of the A wing as comparison...but enjoy the light handling of the unit...

Would appreciate your thoughts!

PPC is much flatter (less dihedral) and much more rigid. Kind of towards the Armstrong part of the spectrum I suppose but not as severe. Seperate strut and leading edge inflate you can get a healthy 8-9 psi in there - which adds to its rigidity.

also the ppc build is bomb proof. Probably the best build (or one of the best like say the Ensis, very similar I noticed actually). No windows which I think is a good thing, can't see through the damn things anyway. But that's a personal preference


so more direct, easier water starts and more direct power to crack into the next swell line than the unit. Also rips upwind and handles back winding much better (which also allows for pointing upwind). All a function of flatness and rigidity. Which also equals a good jumping wing although that's my sons department.

but yeh they weigh a bit more and when flagging you need to adjust technique until it becomes natural again and it's not an issue in really light conditions and moving faster than the wind of course the extra weight means you need a little
more attention keeping it flat. But again you adjust to that as well.


But I could be comparing any two wings across the dihedral to flat to differing profiles to handles to build robustness to and to And to...

They are all good and they all have their plus and minuses, their pros and cons. They all work just fine and most of us are and will be, too sh1te to really exceed the performance capability any wing. But hey we are all gear geeks anyhow and we like to justify our own purchases.


...for those of us who went through the entire kiting development over the past 20 odd years, we eventually got the point of realising there is always a compromise in design and its use. The kite that did it all really well never existed in the end.

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Goofcat said..
As for the suggestion of holding on to the wing when falling, isn't that a good way to damage it? I was taught to fall away from all the gear and to let go of the wing.

I almost always hang on to the wing. That may be a suggestion/method for absolute beginners as it's all foreign to you at that point. When falling the key is to make sure the board is away from you, you can stay hanging onto the wing in most normal foiling situations in my experience. When falling, in a "controlled fall" I always hang on to my wing with both hands, wing overhead; or if in an uncontrolled bail I hold the wing with just the front hand, arm extended so I don't land on it. Then there you are in the water, wing in hand, controlled and not flailing around on it's leash, just gather your board and go again! I've yet to begin jumping or trying spins so advice may differ for that!