Cedrus Aluminum Mast

Project Cedrus just came out with their Engineered Aluminum mast:

projectcedrus.com/cedrus-development/engineered-aluminum/
projectcedrus.com/product/aluminum-mast/

Same stiffness standards and characteristics of their Carbon mast with just 25% added
weight for 25% of the price of the Carbon mast according to the creator.

$230 for a high end light stiff aluminum mast seem like a great deal, especially if you already own
some of the adapters. only 2 Weeks lead time, though you might find the size you need on one of the
retailers he's going to offer it through (MacKite I think).

I was contemplating adding a 96" mast for the big days. Based on my experience with the Carbon Cedrus
and the NoLimitz, I'm leaning towards the Aluminum Cedrus.

These light masts in combination with the small light foils and the small light boards are a dangerous combination
in high winds where the whole setup becomes a flying Machete. Had two close calls with no serious injuries or
damage to equipment but it got me thinking that a little less weight and float might have been a better choice for these days.

Any thoughts?

I bought the carbon one and got it just before the aluminum was announced. I haven't tried to evaluate what I would have done if the alu version had been available a couple of months ago... Given the shorter wait time etc, maybe I would have bought one, but I could have ended up undecided and bought neither one.

I have had two sessions with the carbon mast and there's definite value in the stiffness. I feel much more confident controlling the board and foil. I'm on Takuma foils and was on a Takuma alu mast, which isn't exactly known to be all that stiff...

I don't know yet how I feel about the thickness. The amount of organic debris in the water here right now means that a lot of the time the mast isn't 100% clean anyway, so there's added resistance anywhere between something you can barely feel to driving with the handbrake on. When I think the mast is entirely clean, I don't think I feel a significant difference in drag between it and the Takuma one. The two sessions I've had on the Cedrus have been extremely enjoyable. The first one was actually my all time longest winging GPS track, so if anything, I was able to sail longer without getting tired.

If you're buying the alu mast from scratch, adding the adapter and plate mount will double the price. If you already have the carbon mast and just want a different length for less common conditions, then the alu mast makes a lot more sense. Also, if you're not 100% sure you need a stiffer mast, you could buy the alu set, try it and then decide if you want the carbon one, potentially selling the alu version to someone else once you have made up your mind.

Hopefully with the alu mast, the plates and adapters will become available through local retail worldwide. Having to deal with customs declarations on an individual buyer level is tedious for the buyer.

Thank you for the positive feedback, I hope you like the new mast. The feedback is consistent: stiffness is more critical to performance than drag, at least in the speed range of *most* riders. I am very open and honest about this, and chose to maintain the same mast profile in order to ensure compatibility with all carbon adapters and mounts. Furthermore, it is not possible to change the profile (eg. taper) an extruded aluminum mast.

My goal with the aluminum mast is certainly to have a larger retail presence especially international. Australia is a big market for me, so feel free to PM with any suggestions for shops or retailers who might be interested in carrying the aluminum mast. @juri, northern Europe and Scandinavia is also a big market! Customs paperwork is a big hassle for me, too. Thanks everyone for your patience with the international shipping and duties process.

Sincerely, Kyle

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mindhoc said..

BayAreaKite said..
Thank you for the positive feedback, I hope you like the new mast. The feedback is consistent: stiffness is more critical to performance than drag, at least in the speed range of *most* riders. I am very open and honest about this, and chose to maintain the same mast profile in order to ensure compatibility with all carbon adapters and mounts. Furthermore, it is not possible to change the profile (eg. taper) an extruded aluminum mast.

My goal with the aluminum mast is certainly to have a larger retail presence especially international. Australia is a big market for me, so feel free to PM with any suggestions for shops or retailers who might be interested in carrying the aluminum mast. @juri, northern Europe and Scandinavia is also a big market! Customs paperwork is a big hassle for me, too. Thanks everyone for your patience with the international shipping and duties process.

Sincerely, Kyle

Hi Kyle, this ali version is such a big deal, I remember i asked you if you were ever going to make an Ali before getting my Cedrus 75cm second mast because i thought I wouldn't use it that often.. It is the only mast I use now . Keeping the price under the 1000 AUD is going to make the import process so much smoother and allow people to test heaps of second hand gear across brands before they land on the thing they want. We are yet to see a second hand market for Cedrus Adapters, but I am sure that will come up soon enough.

Regarding the quality, Project Cedrus is the only component in my equipment that I fully trust. Everything else is a "lets see if it survives today's session".

Thanks so much @mindhoc, this means a lot to me. My goal from day 1 was to make a mast that could last a lifetime, which is a tall order in an industry that seems to launch new products every season. It is pretty rewarding to get emails from 2018 Launch Customers who are still loving their mast. At that time, I did not have adapters and actually made a custom fuse for Liquid Force wings. Crazy how quickly the industry has changed.

I have kicked around the concept of an adapter buyback program. I would just need to figure out the logistics or a way to automate it, because I'm already spending more time than I would like with customer service and order fulfillment... it's time to get back to engineering and design:) Or maybe a facebook group, or forum thread, just dedicated to adapter trading/bartering/buying/selling. Cloud Riders facebook is a good example. But I do think it would be good for me to manage used adapter sales as I could inspect version and bless the health of the part, along with including new hardware. There have been times where I would give anything for a certain rare adapter I made 3 years ago, because machining a 1-off now is so expensive and/or the client couldn't afford to wait. Anyway this is good feedback and I'll see about implementation...

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BayAreaKite said..
Thank you for the positive feedback, I hope you like the new mast. The feedback is consistent: stiffness is more critical to performance than drag, at least in the speed range of *most* riders. I am very open and honest about this, and chose to maintain the same mast profile in order to ensure compatibility with all carbon adapters and mounts. Furthermore, it is not possible to change the profile (eg. taper) an extruded aluminum mast.

My goal with the aluminum mast is certainly to have a larger retail presence especially international. Australia is a big market for me, so feel free to PM with any suggestions for shops or retailers who might be interested in carrying the aluminum mast. @juri, northern Europe and Scandinavia is also a big market! Customs paperwork is a big hassle for me, too. Thanks everyone for your patience with the international shipping and duties process.

Sincerely, Kyle

Hey Kyle, how does your aluminum mast stack up against the Axis 19mm?

I used to ride an axis Ali made but got a longer clydesdale cedrus carbon that's lighter and stiffer.

Build is awesome, attention to detail and Kyle gives great customer service and communication. I would bet his new alloy mast is great too.

Mike

Great video! I fortunately haven't had any issues with ventilation with my aluminum Axis 19 mast, but it's nice to know I can blame my breaching on it if I need to ;)

DC

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Grantmac said..
Is this mast sealed and positively buoyant?

Not sealed.

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Velocicraptor said..
Anybody have the aluminum mast yet? Care to provide any insights or commentary compared to the carbon? Any issue riding it with a direct mount fuse (Stringy) vs using an adapter - given the unsealed design? Also any tips on sealing it? I sealed a Takuma mast that I chopped with JB Weld Marine and it was pretty simple, so I assume I can do something similar here.

The Cedrus carbon 85 is my go-to mast, and I'm considering buying a 70 cm aluminum as a short alternative for the handful of times a year I'm winging in an area where depth is marginal.

I ended up picking up the 90cm alum to go with my 80cm carbon. I think it's great, the stiffness compared to most all(except Axis)is superior.
I am not bothering to try seal it-it drains fine and I don't notice any performance difference.

I wound up buying a 70 for a trip. Was concerned about depth, but found enough water and haven't used it yet (it will come in handy someday).

Haven't used it, but engineering, fabrication and finish are as good as I would expect from Cedrus. I'm not surprised, but its quite heavy.

I sealed up the mast with JB Weld marine and it worked perfectly. Taped around the edges and over the threaded holes, applied material to cover the cavities in several applications (epoxy didn't have enough structure to fully enclose in one layer), let it dry with plastic wrap, then sanded it down flush. I think Kyle may be putting out a blog post on sealing these.

Ive heard rumblings from secondary sources (nobody affiliated with Cedrus) that a new thinner profile mast may be coming. Not sure how far out or even whether its true at all.

All of the weights for all models are published and accurate on the site (projectcedrus.com/techspecs/). It's amazing to me how few brands post actual technical specs including weight and profile (thickness, chord) of their products yet have no problem claiming they are faster or lighter these days.

For those still interested in sealing their mast, the blog post has been published: projectcedrus.com/general/aluminum-mast-sealing/

As for rumors regarding "thinner" masts, I'm honored that Cedrus is rumor-worthy however I'm also really tired of discussions related to thickness alone. What matters is drag, and there are a number of variables that contribute to drag beyond thickness, many of which have been discussed extensively on my blog. Chord length is just as significant, and many of these new high modulus masts simply trade thickness for chord length, which increases parasitic drag and weight, and decreases yaw performance. I'm not here to argue that Project Cedrus is fast, but I am here to remind everyone that hydrodynamic optimization is very complex and that it's important to look at all variables. Thickness alone is equivalent to looking at a car and ignoring suspension, handling, tires, weight, aerodynamics... and buying solely based on horsepower. Sure if you want to go fast in a straight line, maybe this is not a bad idea. But if you really like driving, you know that looking at power alone is foolish.