No official live stream, but the German Surfmagazin have taken over a webcam on the roof of a hotel and are providing some coverage.
Live scoring on the PWA site
www.pwaworldtour.com/index.php?id=38&tx_pwaevent_pi1%5BshowUid%5D=332&cHash=3dba48be016aafe08e7080c96be9c9e6
Actually, looks like they have taken their own camera to do this. From the first pictures I saw it wasnt panning.
A decent effort.
Looks like the surf magazine feed is now directly on the PWA page.
Anyway whats the deal with no proper live stream from the PWA - seems a bizarre way to save some cash at the largest event of the year.
Select to expand quoteRoy said..
Looks like the surf magazine feed is now directly on the PWA page.
Anyway whats the deal with no proper live stream from the PWA - seems a bizarre way to save some cash at the largest event of the year.
Apparently they have had budget cuts across the entire event including the pool of price money. I guess is was a matter of putting the money towards a live web cast or towards the price money.
There are two highlight videos on the PWA youtube channel from the women's wave & freestyle. Nothing from the slalom which was held first.
The clips could be some sailors anywhere in the world (ok nowhere with blue skies and seas but....). No mention of any sponsors (just a few of their logos), no commentary, no context. No wonder why sponsors arent spending money.
Its a good job John Carter watermarks his photos as all the photos I've seen from sailors sharing them on their FB pages havent mentioned him. I guess he gets paid by the PWA and gives PWA sailors the nod to share them free of charge. He has taken some amazing photos which capture the event.
A unofficial 'watch along' with Ben Proffitt of the men's wave.
Voice starts @ 3.12
Entertaining as f***.
Elimination 7 final, at last Goyard wins one.
That was Matteo Iachino on the Severne sail who did the big catapult. He cant discard that round as it stands, so that hurt his event ranking a bit.
Select to expand quotePhilUK said..
Elimination 7 final, at last Goyard wins one.
That was Matteo Iachino on the Severne sail who did the big catapult. He cant discard that round as it stands, so that hurt his event ranking a bit.
No that fin slalom was that exciting ... but this is deadly boring!
Select to expand quotePhilUK said..
Elimination 7 final, at last Goyard wins one...
Tight aggressive jibe at second mark and clear air to the finish. He wasn't so aggressive on the following marks where he had room to take safer and wider lines.
Who was on the Duotone just behind him? They were ripping, too.
Select to expand quotePaducah said..PhilUK said..
Elimination 7 final, at last Goyard wins one...
Tight aggressive jibe at second mark and clear air to the finish. He wasn't so aggressive on the following marks where he had room to take safer and wider lines.
Who was on the Duotone just behind him? They were ripping, too.
Pierre Mortefon.
Maciek Rutkowski was leading for most of the event, but crashed out on the SF, Amado Vrieswijk took 2nd in the final and now leads.
Looks like freestyle & waves are up next, to finish their double eliminations. Then it could be back to more slalom Monday in 18-23 knots wind and leftover shoredump
www.pwaworldtour.com/index.php?id=38&tx_pwaevent_pi1%5BshowUid%5D=332&cHash=3dba48be016aafe08e7080c96be9c9e6
It's "deadly boring" until you get out there and try to race. The same thing happened with formula racing. It was "deadly boring" until you were out there trying to make good starts, good angles, good vmg, good survival downwind, good gear tuning, and had good tactics for turns and covering and all the "deadly boring" stuff that goes into course racing.
Downwind slalom is more exciting for the fans on the beach, but there is plenty of excitement for the course racers that are actually out on the water trying to beat everybody else.
Watch what happened at 39 seconds.
The guy touches down and as a result gets thrown over the handlebars at breakneck velocity.
Not convinced the sport is very safe.
That was Matteo Iachino who had the crash, currently 3rd overall.
The problem is when you watch these guys they make it look soooo easy. Is wasnt that windy, 14-19 knots, and I'm sure that swell is bigger than it looks. If they get the wave comp finished tomorrow there might be time left for more slalom. But they wont be able to get the boats off the beach to set a course, and I doubt many foilers would make it through the shorebreak, 1.4m waves are forecast. The racing so far had a smaller swell and was cross shore winds, not cross onshore winds.
I've never liked this multi discipline event for slalom, but the Germans are the only ones with the money. I'm sure Germany has better slalom spots where they can race in strong winds.
I love the upwind downwind racing on the foils. Its back to what i grew up doing in skiff racing - using tactics and reading the wind to try and beat others up and down a course which i cant do as much in slalom racing. I agree that anyone who is doing it would understand theres nothing boring or easy about trying to race foils, particularly in wind over 18 knots.
Select to expand quotesegler said..
It's "deadly boring" until you get out there and try to race. The same thing happened with formula racing. It was "deadly boring" until you were out there trying to make good starts, good angles, good vmg, good survival downwind, good gear tuning, and had good tactics for turns and covering and all the "deadly boring" stuff that goes into course racing.
Downwind slalom is more exciting for the fans on the beach, but there is plenty of excitement for the course racers that are actually out on the water trying to beat everybody else.
Of course it must be exciting when you are in it. But I am a spectator, commenting from a spectator perspective. And watching eight sailors going around some buoys seemingly in a well organized formation is just mind numbing!
The foiling skills are fantastic (says one who still has not been able to foil at all) but that makes the action looking even smoother ... it looks like a synchronized dance on the water. Are they actually racing? would ask a naive spectator.
Not sure how this can be fixed, or if it needs to, America's Cap AC75 have the same problem, made worse by having two boats in the race, and people still sort of watch it. But some drone footage, or having some cameras at the buoys would make for better movies. This close up makes it look like they are much closer then they are, but it is more engaging.
While criticism is not entirely unjustified, none of these issues are new (eg, low wind fin slalom was certainly not more exciting to watch than foil). This of course makes it even more frustrating that the PWA hasn't been able to up its game (imagine what a few additional camera angles with proper live commentary could have done; not only were the conditions quite challenging, the racing itself was tighter than ever with the podium up in the air until the very end). One has to assume it is mostly down to lack of $$$ (and not to incompetence for instance) but that probably makes the problem even harder to overcome in an ever shrinking market.
some impressive (albeit somewhat stomach churning) hd drone footage from day #6 (incl some guys trying to battle it out on the fin)
I find ball sports mind numbing. i really can't see where the fascination is that holds a rather large percentage of the worlds population to a tv screen. I made a concerted effort to sit and watch the footy once, i lasted 10 minutes. Watching grown men/women chase a ball around a field really does nothing to get the dopamine flowing.
I love watching windsurfing, especially slalom, its far from boring for me, it's nail biting if anything. because its what i do i guess. different strokes for different folks
Select to expand quoteduzzi said..
... Of course it must be exciting when you are in it. But I am a spectator, commenting from a spectator perspective. And watching eight sailors going around some buoys seemingly in a well organized formation is just mind numbing!
The foiling skills are fantastic (says one who still has not been able to foil at all) but that makes the action looking even smoother ... it looks like a synchronized dance on the water. Are they actually racing? would ask a naive spectator.
Wait until you hear about Formula 1... 
Segler is right. It seems boring until you do a foil slalom race. It's one of the most fun (and anxiety provoking) things I've ever done on a windsurf board even though I'm horrible (ie slow) at it. Going into the first mark with all the traffic and figuring a way through without botching the jibe was a mind-blowing experience.
360 cameras do a great job of showing the chaos. Maybe there's a way to have onboard cameras like in auto racing? If not the whole fleet, do a couple of the favorites.Plenty of good video out there but I'll try to stay on topic here.
Select to expand quotebel29 said..
some impressive (albeit somewhat stomach churning) hd drone footage from day #6 (incl some guys trying to battle it out on the fin)
Great footage, but it would have been nice to see how they negotiated the shore break when launching and returning to the beach
The first race was slalom and far from boring, the second was a upwind race and was a bore fest.
Select to expand quoteSubsonic said..
I find ball sports mind numbing. i really can't see where the fascination is that holds a rather large percentage of the worlds population to a tv screen. I made a concerted effort to sit and watch the footy once, i lasted 10 minutes. Watching grown men/women chase a ball around a field really does nothing to get the dopamine flowing.
I love watching windsurfing, especially slalom, its far from boring for me, it's nail biting if anything. because its what i do i guess. different strokes for different folks
I agree, l watched the AFL GF.boring. NRL G.F. boring with a capital B. l sat down last night & put Robby Naish Rip video on, watched it all.l have seen it 20 times. Foil racing is boring, they got skills, but cannot watch it. Bring back the glory days of fin slalom racing.l sit down with a ice tea & watch. I rather be out sailing, but not much wind around to get excited about.bring on Shark bay, early in the year.
That drone footage shows the potential for interesting coverage altho the pilot seems high on acid and not too into the race itself. If there was a pilot who understood the sport and commentator working together I think you could get some super interesting coverage, with well positioned shots, especially for watching technique. You would have thought the brands who benefit from much improved coverage would chip in for that given the expense they already go to here in return for poor coverage.
Select to expand quotebel29 said..
some impressive (albeit somewhat stomach churning) hd drone footage from day #6 (incl some guys trying to battle it out on the fin)
That footage is from youtube channel called _FPV, not the PWAs channel. Makes me think they didnt sign away the rights and were doing it for self promotion rather than just for money. It was the type of filming you might see for a brand doing their promotion stuff. It certainly wasnt covering a race as they were flying around all over the place. It did show the size of the swell through, better than a static camera in a hotel near the beach.
Select to expand quotebel29 said..
While criticism is not entirely unjustified, none of these issues are new (eg, low wind fin slalom was certainly not more exciting to watch than foil). This of course makes it even more frustrating that the PWA hasn't been able to up its game (imagine what a few additional camera angles with proper live commentary could have done; not only were the conditions quite challenging, the racing itself was tighter than ever with the podium up in the air until the very end). One has to assume it is mostly down to lack of $$$ (and not to incompetence for instance) but that probably makes the problem even harder to overcome in an ever shrinking market.
Its horses for courses. I cant watch much freestyle, not that interested in it. The Sylt competition in waves was better than flat water freestyle.
The Sylt 'livestream' was Surfmagazine Sylt doing it for free off their own back, seeing as the event organisers couldnt get enough sponsorship for a livestream and commentary.
The last time I looked, around 80 people had 'bought them a coffee', or a small donation of 5 Euros. That wouldnt even pay for the accommodation for 1 person for the event. They were talking in their 2nd language and you could tell from the camera work, focusing, smoothness of panning etc they werent professionals, although they got better to the end of the week. I think did a decent job considering, and better than nothing.
Ben Proffit could have done the job better, but to fly him there, pay for his accommodation and food, transport, plus a wage would cost how much? 3000 Euros? How many people do you need for a livestream,? 2 cameramen + 1 for covering breaks, 10 hour days are long. 2 more for director & techie to sort out issues. Decent camera/drone gear is expensive, and the risk of trashing it in typical Sylt conditions must be factored in.
Select to expand quotePhilUK said..
Ben Proffit could have done the job better, but to fly him there, pay for his accommodation and food, transport, plus a wage would cost how much? 3000 Euros? How many people do you need for a livestream,? 2 cameramen + 1 for covering breaks, 10 hour days are long. 2 more for director & techie to sort out issues. Decent camera/drone gear is expensive, and the risk of trashing it in typical Sylt conditions must be factored in.
3000 Euros? For 11 days? Last I checked a hotel room on Sylt during the World Cup can run you anywhere from 200 to 400 Euros per night. Times that by 13 nights... comp runs for 11 days. Another 50-100 Euro per diem. Plus flights and transport to get there and a wage... 6000 Euros+ for 11 days is probably more realistic. 5 crew inc gear hire is probably running you another 25 to 30,000 Euro at least. If you hire professionals they tend to expect a professional wage.
I wouldn't be surprised if a full Sylt World Cup with 3 disciplines would cost well over a million Euros to run. Insurance alone would be an eye watering amount.
To give you indication of budget cuts... the price money for this World Cup was apparently set at 85,000 Euro. Previous world cups had price money ranging from 120 to 130,000 Euro.
Could you do it on a shoestring budget? Absolutely but you are dealing big name sponsors so you have to be careful with the quality of your output. I doubt Mercedes would want to have their logos slapped all over something that doesn't reflect the high end image of their brand.
Probably a million and 2 reasons why the budget was reduced... last minute decision to go ahead, sponsors already allocated money to other events, uncertainty around the event going ahead at all. Remember Germany still had Covid restrictions until July / August in some settings and are already talking about bring some other restrictions back in November. It makes running an event risky with potentially spending a lot of money and having nothing to show for it.
Select to expand quotestehsegler said..PhilUK said..
Ben Proffit could have done the job better, but to fly him there, pay for his accommodation and food, transport, plus a wage would cost how much? 3000 Euros? How many people do you need for a livestream,? 2 cameramen + 1 for covering breaks, 10 hour days are long. 2 more for director & techie to sort out issues. Decent camera/drone gear is expensive, and the risk of trashing it in typical Sylt conditions must be factored in.
3000 Euros? For 11 days? Last I checked a hotel room on Sylt during the World Cup can run you anywhere from 200 to 400 Euros per night. Times that by 13 nights... comp runs for 11 days. Another 50-100 Euro per diem. Plus flights and transport to get there and a wage... 6000 Euros+ for 11 days is probably more realistic. 5 crew inc gear hire is probably running you another 25 to 30,000 Euro at least. If you hire professionals they tend to expect a professional wage.
I wouldn't be surprised if a full Sylt World Cup with 3 disciplines would cost well over a million Euros to run. Insurance alone would be an eye watering amount.
To give you indication of budget cuts... the price money for this World Cup was apparently set at 85,000 Euro. Previous world cups had price money ranging from 120 to 130,000 Euro.
Could you do it on a shoestring budget? Absolutely but you are dealing big name sponsors so you have to be careful with the quality of your output. I doubt Mercedes would want to have their logos slapped all over something that doesn't reflect the high end image of their brand.
Probably a million and 2 reasons why the budget was reduced... last minute decision to go ahead, sponsors already allocated money to other events, uncertainty around the event going ahead at all. Remember Germany still had Covid restrictions until July / August in some settings and are already talking about bring some other restrictions back in November. It makes running an event risky with potentially spending a lot of money and having nothing to show for it.
Yeah you are correct, its a while since I did much travelling around Europe. For accommodation I would hope that the company doing the livestream would rent a house for everyone to keep the costs down (and their profits up). I guess Ben knows enough people in the business to get room somewhere. 3000 Euros was just a finger in the air guess.
Totally agree with the kit being expensive and you need good quality. A Canon 600mm lens of the type John Carter and other sports photographers use would use for his shots costs 13,000 GBP new these days. Try filming using a cheap 600 GBP bridge camera at Sylt in poor light and rain wouldnt produce the quality.
All for 400-1000 people watching it live.
Select to expand quotebel29 said..
some impressive (albeit somewhat stomach churning) hd drone footage from day #6 (incl some guys trying to battle it out on the fin)
Great Video. it is fast and takes big balls
No one person dominated either
Give me more of this !
I can fully understand a fin flat water windsurfer being concerned about losing fin slalom's place in PWA
Anyway you still go out there and do your thing your local spot and most foilers will be slower off the wind than you
