Hi all,
Apologies for resurrecting this thread but after an hour and a half at Ocean Beach (Umina) on Saturday in what was peeeeeerfect conditions I find myself gutted that I didn't master this bastard. Incidentally I was the only person there (other than a lone kiter) which was odd considering how good it was.
It all seems to be about the rig flip. I had 20-25 knots, flat water with a 6.5 which had me with PLENTY of speed into the gybe only to find that when I got to the rig flip and allowed it to flip it didn't do anything. It just sat there in front of me perfectly balanced and of course I'm periously balanced just past 180 degs into the turn so there's not a lot of scope (or time) to go reaching around to manually reef the sail around. Of course by the time I reached out to do it I was either headed for the drink or off the plane.[}:)]
Managed a couple of emergency rig flips that found me still upright but not planing but so what!!
I'm on a 1990 AHD Omega (an old Tom Leudecke design) which doesn't have a great amount of volume at the tail unlike the new designs. I guess I'll need to get forward more. Any other tips/thoughts about carve gybing an older board??
(Yeh I know the best tip is get rid of the board for a newer one 
)
I suppose also that perhaps a delay in the rig flip will allow the sail to start powering up and happen automatically.
BUGGER
OK, the phrase that's causing you the problem is this bit
"I got to the rig flip and allowed it to flip it didn't do anything"
Now, the nuskool method of gybing is to get about 120 - 140 degrees off the wind (so before you get going dead downwind), and then you aggressively (I mean, REALLY AGGRESSIVELY) throw the rig with your back hand.
DO NOT LOOK AT THE RIG OR YOUR HANDS - look at where you want to go!
If you just let go it will fly like a flag dead downwind of you.
Other tips that allowed me to master the carve:
Get down low - you should be looking at where you want to go through the sail at all times, but you should be looking through the sail BELOW the boom.
Mastfoot pressure, mastfoot pressure, mastfoot pressure!
BTW - I find gybing far easier by leaving my front foot in the front strap all the way through the gybe and then changing afterwards - it allows me to do one thing at a time, rather than everything all at once and gives more control. Personal preference though.
GOOD LUCK!
Thanks FS,
I must admit after reading this thread and looking at all the videos, arriving at Ocean Beach knowing that it was going to be as smooth as it looked on the videos I was so OVER confident I figured I'd just go straight to blindfolded lawdown carve gybes. I mean what can go wrong when you're not going to get knocked over by chop!!!
After the first full speed approach where 20 degrees into it my back foot slipped off the leeward rail leaving me with my front foot caught in the straps and my "jewels" sitting snugly on the back foot strap doing the splits I thought,"OK, Guy Cribb didn't mention THIS!!" It's amazing how long you can plane when the jewels are in a vulnerable position
I have a new found respect for those that make it look as easy as simply turning a wheel ... especially in some solid chop (which I WASN'T IN).
Please tell me that the new boards stay on a plane a lot longer these days.
All I have to do now is convince the better half that I will need to get up there again ................ Ocean Beach that is!?
OUCH!
I suspect that you'll have to get really far forward with loads of mastfoot pressure on that board. Yup, I'm sure that the newer boards would help, but it's all about technique...
I actually have the mast leaning forwards over the nose as I go into a gybe -and to do that you've gotta be LOW and have loads of mastfoot pressure
Here's a pic of a mate Fox cranking into a gybe, which might help...
www.flyingshingle.co.uk/gc2005.htm
This took me quite a while to learn - whilst you're doing it, don't forget to try tacking and duck gybes to break up the monotony of crashing. I actually found duckgybes considerably easier than carves - just remember to duck the sail at about 135 degrees off the wind (and later and you'll crash), and make sure you grab the boom grip - NOT the metal boom extension - that hurts...
Good luck, don;t dispair - it takes a while...
A 6.5 will make it difficult for your first planing exit... I did mine on a 5.7, which was plenty.
Another trick is to practice the flip with a small sail in the backyard, with your eyes shut. Like, really shut. Or at night.
Old hand overgrip, new hand undergrip...
Good luck, when you get it you'll understand how worth it all those failed attempts are!
I think this forum needs a permanent active thread on gybe technique (along with the one on how to get two piece masts apart when they are stuck).
I too have been digesting this thread and went to the river on Saturday in great anticipation of finally completing a gybe. I feel I got closer than ever and actually might have completed a few if the tide hadn't been so low - that grinding sound of fin on sand caused me to jump off quick smart. I did move deeper after that...
I end up pointing in the right direction (180 degrees opposite to my start point) but getting that pesky rig to a place where I can catch it is the trick.
I'll keep following all this good advice and try again next time it is windy.
here's a 6min grab of the guy cribb dvd. It has some excellent slow mo shots of how to
gybe properly
When i do my PHD, I'm going to do a thesis on the Gybe. It's probably the most discussed and most convoluted / complex move in windsurfing....so many steps in such a short time.
yeah, it's like a golf swing - so much happens in the space of a few seconds.
my tips from my experiences;
speed in the entry will let you get away with almost anything
keep your hips well to the inside of the turn even after the flip, and lean forward as much as you dare
my rig flip and foot change starts from rotating the torso
the heavier the chop the more you need to bend your knees (get low)
solid gybing is about commitment - go in focused and hard and your chances of planing out increase exponentially.
i don't aggressively flip the sail; time it right and it will swing on it's own as soon as you release your rear hand.
and guy cribb's movie is excellent - I picked up two flaws in my technique*, even though i been gybing for years.
*and I'm sure there are many more! perfecting our craft takes a lifetime or more, and is a definite labour of love for me.
I've been getting better averages with my gybes lately and nailing over 3/4 of them...and, as only a recent gyber for the first time (?) I find that 3 things have helped me immensely.
1. slide front hand along boom to mast. (or as close as possible) whilst planing and hooked in.
2. once initialising the gybe by pushing sail forward, get weight forward (after unhooking and moving back foot across to other side of board of course), both feet should be level, and in line with front straps or just in front of straps.
3. BEND KNEES. This one helps with balance, and allows for any movement the board might do due to chop, or body weight transfer.
And in all honesty, the rig-flip will come later...I wait until the wind nearly pulls it from my back hand, and then just reach (under front arm) underhanded and grab boom as far back as possible to maintain balance...
...Otherwise, you can actually sail clew-first, so why flip the rig at all?
I've been going out of my mind...after a week of 20 knot days in Vietnam and lots of good days here with very flat water, it's still not coming together.
I can honestly say that recently I've done a few really, really nice gybes - I got a sense that the timing was nearly perfect, everything was happening smoothly and in the right order and it was all good - except that the f$#%@*# rig flip still stumps me. At least my waterstarts aren't getting rusty!
Some people have been saying that you have to let the sail load up and it will flip itself - I've been trying this, just a quick dip as I initiate the carve, then put the sail up and let it power me thru the turn, and yes it feels good but the rig doesn't flip itself unless I turn all the way up into the wind, which I don't want to do.
And I've tried the "aggressively throw the rig around" thing before but it felt pretty ineffectual at the time - I mean, how can you throw it harder than it wants to go? But anyway, I'll try this approach next time, with renewed vigour...
Yup, plenty of speed, the rig goes light, and then you can throw it. Seriously, do it in your yard - just practice throwing the rig.
Then do it again and again and again until you can do it blindfold.
Now do it crouched right down, so your eye-level is under the boom and you're leaning yourself and the rig forwards.
Now go back out on the water.
Oh, and for all those trying to do the rig flip late - yes, this can work, and it works with big sails, but it's nowhere near as satisfying and cool.... Go Early - it'll make life a lot easier...
why, during the rig flip does your new front hand pass under the current front hand rather than over ?
Hey Bristol are you still talking about windsurfing???
Double entendre to the MAX .... he he he he he he
ANYWAY ..... love all this detail. Seems like there are many variations on timing of the rig flip depending on personal choice so will try them all. It sounds like I still have about 100 crash and burns to go. As long as they are not the "jewels straddled on the back foot strap whilst planing" methode I will be happy.
If anyone wants any pointers to master this just drop me a line
There's a lot of talk about being aggressive into the Gybe so I might incorporate a Lleyton Hewitt "C'MOOOOOOOORRRRN" into my pre-rig flip move. Gotta fire up somehow. I think after awhile you start wondering where you're going to stuff it up.
I think there are now two things to master
1. Convincing my better half that I haven't become obsessed with windsurfing again (which is a lie).
2. That I convince her that I really should look at some newer gear...
As the saying goes, I think I have two changes of succeeding...
Penski, unlike most things you can blow money on, the thing about buying new windsurfing gear is that you never regret it. It feels good. No guilty feelings, even if you have to live on oatmeal and apples for a month.
keep at it dudes,
I have been working on Gybing most of this summer and in the past week have managed a few planning gybes and man it rocks and am landing more and more every session.
My stubble with the rig flip was grabbing the other side of the boom, I found pulling the rig towards me with my old front hand as I went for the under pass grab with my new hand helped heaps.
Select to expand quotePenski said...
...... I'm periously balanced just past 180 degs into the turn so there's not a lot of scope (or time) to go reaching around to manually reef the sail around.
Sound like you may be straightening up during the rig flip (i.e. board stops carving and heads off down wind). You then cannot grab the new side of the boom.
The key for me preventing this is looking over your shoulder at where you are going. I have seen this on Harty's videos for years but only started doing it recently
It turns out that you do not have to look at the boom for it to be there and by looking where you are going you keep carving and the rig flips to a position where you can catch it easily (particularly if you have been practising as Per Nebbians comments).
Well a lot of discussion on Gybing. I notice that the word "Foot" was only mentioned about 3 times. There are two distincts gybes. One where the feet change position before or during the sail flip and the other where the sail is flipped and the sailor is planing out of the gybe and then he changes his feet.
If you are in good wind and fairly flat then I think it is best to change the feet after the sail has been flipped. I see a lot of attempts at gybes where the sailor is changing feet and the sail is nearly clew first. I leave the front foot in the footstrap till the sail has been flipped and hopefully I am planing and then a quick foot change. You need fairly constant wind to get it right. If just dogging around in non planing conditions then I change my feet first. Good Luck...about 2000 attempts should see most people get a few.
Wet Willy,
Do you really want to get good at gybing and then be known as........................................
.......................................... Dry Willy ??
another tip to help with your gybes is borrow a JP.
seriously, they are unbelievable in the gybes.
