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Challenge for the mathematicians / statisticians

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Created by IBM > 9 months ago, 10 Jan 2015
IBM
NSW, 15 posts
10 Jan 2015 9:49PM
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Challenge for the mathematicians / statisticians – handicap system for One Design Class to improve engagement.

Could a One Design class (non-Olympic) include a Handicap result system as well as line honours? Would this increase the engagement of new racers and retain racers for ones that fall outside the optimum design parameters of the class of board/rig configuration?

Scenario: say Windsurfer One Design – for the benefit of a sailor at 50kg or 100kg where the optimum may be 75kg in the majority of wind conditions.

What if sailors of various sizes, age, experience and proven results could be incorporated to a formula to give a “Fair Handicap Result”, what could the formula look like? And do you think anyone would really care about a handicap result? Would a handicap system encourage racers outside of the sweet spot for ideal weight range?

A thought could be to use a discount or loading to an over the line result taking into account:

1. Wind strength average between the start of the race and the last racer over the line as an average in knots between the two.
2. Weight of the racer, dry weight prior to start of each race day, championships included over several consecutive days.
3. A “Par” system for experience as a loading, if you are placed No.1 at the previous National Championships (or whatever event had the Most competitors), you incur the highest skill loading, say like golf “Scratch”. If you came last (position 100) in the last ranking event, you get a 100 point loading to assist you in corrected time allowances. Thus encouraging improvement for corrected time result.

Any thoughts? Or is this a pointless question?

tonymatta
QLD, 358 posts
11 Jan 2015 10:35AM
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scoring software usually include capability for performance based handicaps.
we use it for club racing over a season. it is not much use for championships with a small number of races over a short period.

IBM
NSW, 15 posts
11 Jan 2015 10:40PM
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Thank you for your reply post @tonymatta,

Great point regarding current scoring software that clubs use over a long period of time, just wondering if a + or - results loading could achieve a simple solution to allow for weight categories/bands at championships or smaller sample group regattas? Should weight be a benefit or handicap IF all the gear is a controlled one design

Would it be possible as a mathematical solution, or would it be more like a dart board science? Other than the sailors outside of the optimum weight range for the gear would it really matter or would anyone really care?

Or, would it be better/easier to stick to weight divisions (weight bands 55 - 65, 65 - 75, 75 - 85, 85 - 95 kg etc...) and just report line honours for weight division only.

Should a handicap system even be considered

Eg. Only reason for the inquiry is that when you look at offshore yacht racing like the "Sydney to Hobart" yacht race, super maxi's win the Line honour category the majority of the time but the rating / handicap system adjusts for other factors for other starters and pushes the line honours winner to beat their impairment against them.

Could this be something to improve engagement, with a Fair Handicap system

tonymatta
QLD, 358 posts
12 Jan 2015 2:45AM
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I don't think it is worth bothering. Sailing is about having fun and hanging out with friends. If you can't enjoy sailing without wining races then don't bother.
As long as there is someone in front of you doing the same course, you can have something to aim for and manage your progress against.
Championships are good to bring together sailors from different clubs from time to time and can be a fun holiday. If you make it just about winning then championships just produce a big bunch of lousers.
Club racing is where most sailing happens and your club can decide how much trouble they want to take to level the playing field. Just ask your own members if they care or not. Ours certainly don't.

boardsurfr
WA, 2454 posts
12 Jan 2015 1:34AM
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Select to expand quote
IBM said..
Challenge for the mathematicians / statisticians – handicap system for One Design Class to improve engagement.

Could a One Design class (non-Olympic) include a Handicap result system as well as line honours?

...

Any thoughts? Or is this a pointless question?


It's a very good question. I know several racers who stopped racing long ago because they had no chance against lighter racers who'd plane earlier.

The Kona One class uses a simple system where the sail size is based on body weight. Sail sizes for men range from 6.6 m (under 65 kg) to 9.8 m (from 98 kg), see class.konaone.com/Page/718/class-rules/. I participated in one Kona One race with 16 racers in conditions ranging from light to fully planing. The handicapping worked quite well, with final results determined by skills, not by size. More details about my impressions at boardsurfr.blogspot.com/2014/05/i-love-kona-racing.html

Besides the sail size handicap, two other things helped to make the races fun and fair: the board design, which works well for different weights; and the no-pumping rule. Kona One is also affordable, and a well-established one design class, with 106 competitors at the 2014 Kona One World Championship last November.

IBM
NSW, 15 posts
12 Jan 2015 11:16PM
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@tonymatta, thanks heaps for your response. Pretty much agree if your outside the sweet spot and not too serious, who cares. "Any day on the water with friends is better than not sailing". Just annoying doing club racing and hoping to finish before the start boat pulls up anchor. Better learn how to pump better and visit the gym

or as @boardsurfr suggests the Kona One, never tried them and haven't seen one in person, but it looks like a fun compromise. Not as affordable as a new Wallie for example, but they do look interesting and a good workaround for body weight variances within one fleet.

Thanks to all, really appreciate the effort in responding.



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"Challenge for the mathematicians / statisticians" started by IBM