Theres a lot of comments floating around that foiling on the NP Glide with a with a power box could end up failing and could end up losing the foil. Should I tether the foil to the board in case of failure..if so, How?.
Most people don't bother, but I have seen one guy tie a rope around the top of the foil mast. Not sure where he attached it maybe the leash plug (it was a wing board). This probably works better if you are using the pedestal adapter
One guy put these on the foil mast (www.northshoreinc.com/store/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=338&idcategory=93) with the intention of tying the foil to something on the board
No not needed. I've used the pb adapter for over a year on my 2010 fanatic shark. Hit the foil several times on shallow rocks and what not. Every was in tact. The pb adapter is designed to distribute the forces .. that is for beginners use, recreational use. Not the radiculo stuff.
What you do need to do is regularly tighten the screw. It tends to loosen.
So does Slingshot.
A tether is cheap insurance. See photo. Get a pair of those zip tie stick-on bases. Peel off the adhesive foam, and replace with the 3M gray adhesive foam that you can get at any auto parts store. Attach to the foil, and run a length of coated kite line from them to the footstrap. Cheap and easy. The coated kite line can be tied and untied repeatedly without fraying.
Windance on Hood River is very insistent on tethers. They have seen enough lost and broken foils to be so insistent.
Been using a tether on Naish setup since day 1, the same string for 130+ days now.
Slight warbling noise on foil, to alert sea life when I'm foiling.
The problem I heard is the boards that use a single M6 screw end up getting it pulled through the box and then you lose the foil, lots of foils lost that way according to guys at windance.
Select to expand quoteLeeD said..
Some people look at the problem and think......big washers.
yes, but you are limited by the recess diameter, evidently that was too small on a lot of boards.
If you tether it using the various stick on anchors run the leash around the mast as well. They can keep the line from pulling off the top of the mast but I don't think will take the full force of the foil breaking away.
Check if your foil assembly floats or sinks.. My early foils would sink so I used a tether to the back footstrap.. Most new foils float so there's no chance of loosing them so I no longer use a tether.
This is my system - will save me if bolt pulls through board but stays attached to mast head - I definitely hit things out there, but dedicated foilboards seem to have strong tuttle box and no pull throughs yet despite some sudden stops and mighty crashes .... not sure it is really necessary, but no downside as not in the way
Select to expand quoteLeeD said..
My God, you can't use BIGGER washers that span the cavity?
Or fill that cavity?
If you span the cavity with a large washer you have to use a longer screw and that increases the chances the screw could break, but on my board you would be putting the large washer on the eva deck padding which is not a stable surface, also a large diameter washer on a M6 screw could result in the small screw head collapsing the washer. If you think before writing you wont get your head all smelly
You forgot PB retention includes a plate on the bottom, which holds the foil mast from moving, by spreading out the load across the bottom of the board around the fin box.
This takes a LOT of the load away from the screw.
Plenty of guys using standard M-6 with Power Plate getting over 80+ days with no problems.
You also see big aluminum plates on the top of the board, that act as a giant washer resting on the top deck. Even some foilers with DT two-bolt chimneyed systems use big plates this way.
Select to expand quoteLeeD said..
Plenty of guys using standard M-6 with Power Plate getting over 80+ days with no problems.
I am sure that is true LeeD, but maybe they did not hit anything. When you hit something with the foil there is a downward force on the screws and the biggest bottom plate will not help with that. Now like segler points out a top plate will help. AFS includes a top plate with two holes in it made out of carbon fiber for that purpose, but you need a board with a flat deck around the screw recesses to use it, think their AHD boards have that feature.
I guess the lesson in this is: never hit anything. In shallow Florida, good luck. I hit stuff there all the time, mainly shallow sand bars. If I absolutely must have deep water, I opt for freshwater lakes. The problem with them is alligators.
Up in the Columbia Gorge pretty much all waters are nice and deep. No gators, but hitting fish can be a hazard.
Select to expand quotesegler said..
You also see big aluminum plates on the top of the board, that act as a giant washer resting on the top deck. Even some foilers with DT two-bolt chimneyed systems use big plates this way.
I use a massively oversized washer on the back bolt. Had it made in a machine shop for almost nothing. Works very well with a thin rubber layer between it and the board, and because the board does not have chimneyed bolt holes. Have been foiling with it for 3 years like that, no probs. But I will be using a tether when the new race foil arrives.
Select to expand quoteSmidgeuk said..segler said..
You also see big aluminum plates on the top of the board, that act as a giant washer resting on the top deck. Even some foilers with DT two-bolt chimneyed systems use big plates this way.
I use a massively oversized washer on the back bolt. Had it made in a machine shop for almost nothing. Works very well with a thin rubber layer between it and the board, and because the board does not have chimneyed bolt holes. Have been foiling with it for 3 years like that, no probs. But I will be using a tether when the new race foil arrives.
yeah, not having chimneyed bolt holes helps, otherwise you could pull the washer into the board since it is probably not nearly as strong as the top of the box where the screw normally rests.
Select to expand quoteToe said..
Theres a lot of comments floating around that foiling on the NP Glide with a with a power box could end up failing and could end up losing the foil. Should I tether the foil to the board in case of failure..if so, How?.
I never really understood the power box idea ... why give up the safety of a Tuttle to save ten seconds when you change a fin?
Anyway, holding up a foil with one bolt seems like asking for it. So yes! use a tether!
Never had an issue with my slingshot deep tuttle. Besides, I need an excuse to buy all carbon wing so I'm not totally adverse to losing it ;)
DC
Powerbox is simply a holdover from the old days of fins on thin-tailed boards. It came out as a competitor to the US-track boards of the time. For fins with moderate side forces, it was, and is still, just fine. Many, many finning boards today still feature the powerbox.
Tuttle originally came out when fins got longer and tails got thicker and side forces got bigger. This culminated in formula boards with 70 cm deep tuttle fins and 3-5" thick tails.
And now, since deep tuttle always had the most structural strength anyway, it was the initial finbox standard for foiling. Still is, even with the added reinforcements.
However, now they are getting away from even DT, and moving toward reinforced dual-track systems. This is the future. With all the modularity of current and future foils, having fore and aft adjustability of the foil itself (along with such things as Slingshot's ABC system) is a huge thing for our sport. Other adjustability includes fore and aft movable footstraps and extra long sail mast tracks.
We all benefit. We can try to be physicists with balancing our gear, but the huge adjustability of foils, straps, and sail tracks will make balancing by trial and error easy to do.
Hey Smidgeuk do you have a pic of your setup? Also if anyone has pics of their tether system from foil to board to get a few ideas.
Thanks everyone
Yes, a loop is fine if you have a flanged foil. For those without flanges (SB, Moses, others) a loop will simply slip over the top if there is a break at the head. In such a case you have to somehow stick the leash to the foil like I showed with the LP foil above.
I am a little suspicious of foils that float. That has to mean that they are using wood or foam cores under the carbon layup. This is great for light weight, but I question whether they have enough carbon fiber structure to hold up to the various forces found in foiling. Only time will tell. I hope they succeed.
Most larger freeride wings will float on their own. Slingshot certainly will, but they have had issues with layups. Starboard wings float too and I think the current Naish.
The thing that makes most sink is the fuselage.
Fuselages seem to be very over built behind the mast and that is where a hybrid aluminum/carbon setup like the new Starboard QL could create just enough volume to achieve neutral buoyancy.
That said I'm not 100% sure that floating makes for an easier handling foil, especially for winging. I've watched a guy with an Armstrong foil (which floats) trash a wing because it would only float on its side in a shorebreak.
So maybe putting the flotation in the mast like a Project Cedrus would be a more stable option?
Having had a foil sitting on the bottom before (until low tide) I know I would prefer one that floats.
Usually, the board breaks before the foilmast connection, so a loop works 90% of the time.
