Hi all, I've read on this forum that some people have used kite wings for windfoiling. I was thinking about getting the Naish S25 650 kite wing. Was going to pair it with the HA 310 and or 280 stabs and 80 cm fuse. Was also thinking I might need a longer fuse for pitch stability. Does anyone know about or have any experience with the above? Was thinking the 650 might be a good high wind option?
I got maybe 40 days with Hover 122, 600 kitewing, 65 and 79 fuze, kite and 310 stab..mostly 4.0 to 6.0.
Needs maybe 2 mph more wind than 1220 foil, feels much faster, easier glide, low drag, jibes same.
With 210 stab, needs more wind and is less stable.
If possible, go for the windfoil fuse. Windfoils, because of the weight and variable pressure, on the rig need a longer fuse for stability. Also, especially if you are using a tuttle box, the windfoil use puts the wing further forward which is what you need to get the balance correct - otherwise, it'll be harder if not almost impossible to get the board off the water.
I tried the 600 wing 2020 model on the long fuse only once, I found it very unstable, not pitch wise, but laterally. I think I needed more speed to make it work.
600 is a different animal between 310 or 210 stabs.
310 is friendly and only needs a couple more knots boatspeed. It does need about 1.5" forward placement from 1150, and a bit more fron 1220.
210 is hugely different. Almost 3" forward and still needs much more sustained boatspeed to get stable.
As for lateral, 600 is same width as 1220, so feels fine.
Pitch with 310 and 79 fuze is fine, but nervous with 210 stab, not o ly smaller, but not swept back at all effe timely giving a shorter fuze length.
Select to expand quoteLeeD said..
600 is a different animal between 310 or 210 stabs.
310 is friendly and only needs a couple more knots boatspeed. It does need about 1.5" forward placement from 1150, and a bit more fron 1220.
210 is hugely different. Almost 3" forward and still needs much more sustained boatspeed to get stable.
As for lateral, 600 is same width as 1220, so feels fine.
Pitch with 310 and 79 fuze is fine, but nervous with 210 stab, not o ly smaller, but not swept back at all effe timely giving a shorter fuze length.
When you say about 1.5" forward placement from 1150 for the 310, i assume you mean stab position on the fuse? Ie tap some new threads in your fuse and position the 310 1.5" forward (closer to the the front wing / 650) from where you use it with the 1150?
This will make it less stable (more pitch sensitive) and more turny won't it? Ie you are effectively reducing fuse length? Given that you will be going faster on the 650 than on the 1150, if anything, wouldn't you want a longer fuse to aid stability?
Select to expand quoteLeeD said..
Effective is hard to spell.
That's ok. It's a big word.
Forward means sliding the whole foil forward, since the center of lift is farther back on mist small foils compared to their lower aspect bigger brothers.
Sliding foil forwards is allowed on boards with twin tracks.
Select to expand quoteLeeD said..
Forward means sliding the whole foil forward, since the center of lift is farther back on mist small foils compared to their lower aspect bigger brothers.
Sliding foil forwards is allowed on boards with twin tracks.
That makes more sense.
On Tuttle box foil boards, you adjust by swimming the stabilizer angle, which normally gives enough adjustment of lift, but you can also shim the main foil if needed.
Most sailors using Tuttle for foil keep their wings somewhat close and many have multiple fuselages and stabs to adjust for different wing shapes and sizes.
Select to expand quoteLeeD said..
On Tuttle box foil boards, you adjust by swimming the stabilizer angle, which normally gives enough adjustment of lift, but you can also shim the main foil if needed.
Most sailors using Tuttle for foil keep their wings somewhat close and many have multiple fuselages and stabs to adjust for different wing shapes and sizes.
So shimming the stab or front wing has the the same effect as moving the whole foil forward, thereby better positioning your feet over the centre of lift on a smaller higher aspect front wing?
Select to expand quoteSambo # said..LeeD said..
On Tuttle box foil boards, you adjust by swimming the stabilizer angle, which normally gives enough adjustment of lift, but you can also shim the main foil if needed.
Most sailors using Tuttle for foil keep their wings somewhat close and many have multiple fuselages and stabs to adjust for different wing shapes and sizes.
So shimming the stab or front wing has the the same effect as moving the whole foil forward, thereby better positioning your feet over the centre of lift on a smaller higher aspect front wing?
Shimming the stab changes the trimmed speed of the foil, only moving the foil or changing stabilizer adjusts the balance across the speed range.
Select to expand quoteGrantmac said..Sambo # said..LeeD said..
On Tuttle box foil boards, you adjust by swimming the stabilizer angle, which normally gives enough adjustment of lift, but you can also shim the main foil if needed.
Most sailors using Tuttle for foil keep their wings somewhat close and many have multiple fuselages and stabs to adjust for different wing shapes and sizes.
So shimming the stab or front wing has the the same effect as moving the whole foil forward, thereby better positioning your feet over the centre of lift on a smaller higher aspect front wing?
Shimming the stab changes the trimmed speed of the foil, only moving the foil or changing stabilizer adjusts the balance across the speed range.
Can u explain this in more detail please? What is trimmed speed? What is balance across speed range? And can u give examples of how changing the things u mention above affect these performance aspects?
"Trimmed speed".....speed range when your setup is balanced.
'Across the speed range".....speed range including too low a speed, medium, and high end.
Often, when you add shim to balance your desired speed range, you end up with bad low end AND bad top end....but balanced mid range.
You can shim for top speed, but you really hurt low end and still not right for mid range.
Or shim for low end, and be wrong for mid and top.
To really be able to use different foils and styles, you need a board with twin track. AND Tuttle, for dedicated race gear that uses long fuze forward of the foil mast base, allowing the Tuttle to be located far back in windsurf position [almost].
Select to expand quoteLeeD said..
"Trimmed speed".....speed range when your setup is balanced.
'Across the speed range".....speed range including too low a speed, medium, and high end.
Often, when you add shim to balance your desired speed range, you end up with bad low end AND bad top end....but balanced mid range.
You can shim for top speed, but you really hurt low end and still not right for mid range.
Or shim for low end, and be wrong for mid and top.
To really be able to use different foils and styles, you need a board with twin track. AND Tuttle, for dedicated race gear that uses long fuze forward of the foil mast base, allowing the Tuttle to be located far back in windsurf position [almost].
Yeah right. Thx.
From Z himself....
Since he only advocates turrle box....
He recommends shimming, if balance is off.
With HA, shimming works. But buy a complete Z setup, and get a board matched for it.
Wow, spellcheck is just killing me! I had to retype more than 4 times to get shim. And tuttle.
Resurrecting this thread because I got the 650 S26 wing and gave it a try yesterday.
Had a 5.8 Koncept freeride sail, wind was 12 to 14 knts, so a bit underpowered, stab was 280 HA and long fuse - 105 cm.
- Very easy to handle for windfoiling, feels like a smaller 914, pretty stable
- Needs more speed to get going, about 12-13 knts and then you can start flying and it needs very little wind to keep going
- Very stable if maintaining about 15knts speed, which is easy, but the board will drop suddenly if you slow down, so its harder to jibe
- Very fast and smooth, looking fwd to try with more wind
