I have a foi x 145 and a super cruiser foil which I really enjoy. As wind gets stronger and to explore a different style of foiling I was wondering if the board would work with outboard straps and a higher aspect foil ( maybe afs w85 ) ? Any thoughts appreciated
Yes, it works
I switch back and forth between a delta 1220 and a mid-hot aspect 600, in the same wind with same board and sail. Naish.
Maybe 2mph more speed is needed on the small wing, but it handles that much more up top.
My favorite board is 72x180cm, so similar to the FoilX, I use it with single backstrap and medium outboard frontstraps. Have dabbled with low aspect wings, but to be honest, nothing beats the performance of a higher aspect foil for lake conditions or freestyle. I just can't do without the speed and improved ability to glide through lulls a higher aspect foil gives.
No one ever said a small board would not work with a higher aspect foil. As you are more on top of the foil on a small board its really hard to overpower the foil (like it is the other way round, a low aspect with a formula for example is very unstable as its easy to put too much preassure on the foil), or to generate enough power from the foil to overpower the board. Just my personal experience. The only remark I would make on the subject is that a foil which naturally sails flatter would be better suited for the practice. In that regard the AFS would be an excellent choice. (As would be the F-One Levo Carbon, the foil I use)
A small board with a high aspect foil is the combo of choice for most freestylers! (Balz M?ller, Steven van Broeckhoven, the Horue guys)
A little too tired to expand on the subject, but I will follow the thread, and if you want user experience of combining small boards with fast foils, or have questions I'll gladly answer them ;).
Starboard is releasing higher aspect wings and tails for that foil in the next few months. So you can likely save a bunch of money compared to an entirely new setup.
Select to expand quoteGrantmac said..
Starboard is releasing higher aspect wings and tails for that foil in the next few months. So you can likely save a bunch of money compared to an entirely new setup.
That would make sense . Do you know what they are releasing that would fit ? Are they just going to be smaller versions of the existing wing ?
Select to expand quoteWhiteofHeart said..
My favorite board is 72x180cm, so similar to the FoilX, I use it with single backstrap and medium outboard frontstraps. Have dabbled with low aspect wings, but to be honest, nothing beats the performance of a higher aspect foil for lake conditions or freestyle. I just can't do without the speed and improved ability to glide through lulls a higher aspect foil gives.
No one ever said a small board would not work with a higher aspect foil. As you are more on top of the foil on a small board its really hard to overpower the foil (like it is the other way round, a low aspect with a formula for example is very unstable as its easy to put too much preassure on the foil), or to generate enough power from the foil to overpower the board. Just my personal experience. The only remark I would make on the subject is that a foil which naturally sails flatter would be better suited for the practice. In that regard the AFS would be an excellent choice. (As would be the F-One Levo Carbon, the foil I use)
A small board with a high aspect foil is the combo of choice for most freestylers! (Balz M?ller, Steven van Broeckhoven, the Horue guys)
A little too tired to expand on the subject, but I will follow the thread, and if you want user experience of combining small boards with fast foils, or have questions I'll gladly answer them ;).
Thanks, really helped. In your opinion is there a difference between high aspect and just a smaller version of a low aspect foil ? Is it the shape not the size ? ( sorry if it's a stupid question) . As next person who responded said starboard are bringing out new front wings that will fit super cruiser ( 1200 it would appear having researched) but it basically just looks like a smaller version of the current 1700 wing .
Like look of afs 95 which comes with 2 wings , 700 and 800 but big investment if I can just change existing front wing and get same result . Confused as usual !!
The new SB wings are higher aspect and I'm guessing thinner so they should be significantly faster. Especially the X-type 1100.
I think a lot of the speed is in the stab as well and there are faster ones out now.
Honestly having used an AFS I don't feel like the SC1700 is much slower.
A small low aspect wing is just a low aspect wing for more wind, sure its a little faster, but you'll need a lot more power to get going, and the improvement in glide and speed isnt as big.
Remember, a high aspect wing gives about 1,5-2x times as much power / lift as a similarly sized low aspect wing. In the end, a 1100cm2 high aspect will give the same, if not more early lift than your supercruiser, with more speed and more glide through lulls. The downside being its more direct, and has a lower stall speed due to its smaller surface (although you're traveling at different speeds aswell, so always wondering, would you rather have a foil averaging at 25kph with 15kph stall speed, or a foil averaging 35kph with a 20kph stall speed? The second one has a wider range of use and allows for more loss of speed in the jibe). A low aspect wing is soft, you won't feel much if you get a gust or a chop, whereas a higher aspect wing has a little more direct / agressive power.
Also remember, if wings are similarly sized, the stall speed is similar, although the performance in terms of speed and lift doesn't at all have to be.
As for the AFS, i've tried the 85 with F800 (standard freeride) wing, and clocked around 45kph with it. A supercruiser would never go that fast.
You are confusing the current wings with what I'm talking about which is more like a bit larger version of the Starboard race wings.
I've done 40-41km/h on the SC, using wave sails. It's higher aspect than the I76 for instance.
^^ as above just grab the xtype 1100 and a smaller stab, you 'll save $$$ and have best of both worlds
Select to expand quoteGrantmac said..
You are confusing the current wings with what I'm talking about which is more like a bit larger version of the Starboard race wings.
I've done 40-41km/h on the SC, using wave sails. It's higher aspect than the I76 for instance.
Apparently only stype 1200 will fit super cruiser fuselage.
DarrylG, I've not seen a standard Starboard wave fuselage, apart from review videos, but I feel the SC fuselage is maybe longer where the wing bolts onto it..as it has 3 sets of bolt holes.
So presumably either wing will have to have enough depth to mount onto the SC fuselage.
It would be great if Starboard could confirm which wing is compatible with either a SC or wave fuselage, or both
It will fit in the forward position which is what you'd want with a smaller stab.
It will fit in the forward position which is what you'd want with a smaller stab.
Select to expand quoteGrantmac said..
It will fit in the forward position which is what you'd want with a smaller stab.
Any recommendations as to which stab would pair best with the x1100 wing ?
Select to expand quoteGrantmac said..
Starboard is releasing higher aspect wings and tails for that foil in the next few months. So you can likely save a bunch of money compared to an entirely new setup.
Yes they are, I took my new E 1300 for a spin on the weekend!
So lots of questions!
was the e type mounted on the SC fuselage?
which board did you try it on? Did it affect the overall balance of the foil compared to the standard SC configuration?
Select to expand quoteWhiteofHeart said..
A small low aspect wing is just a low aspect wing for more wind, sure its a little faster, but you'll need a lot more power to get going, and the improvement in glide and speed isnt as big.
Remember, a high aspect wing gives about 1,5-2x times as much power / lift as a similarly sized low aspect wing. In the end, a 1100cm2 high aspect will give the same, if not more early lift than your supercruiser, with more speed and more glide through lulls. The downside being its more direct, and has a lower stall speed due to its smaller surface (although you're traveling at different speeds aswell, so always wondering, would you rather have a foil averaging at 25kph with 15kph stall speed, or a foil averaging 35kph with a 20kph stall speed? The second one has a wider range of use and allows for more loss of speed in the jibe). A low aspect wing is soft, you won't feel much if you get a gust or a chop, whereas a higher aspect wing has a little more direct / agressive power.
Also remember, if wings are similarly sized, the stall speed is similar, although the performance in terms of speed and lift doesn't at all have to be.
As for the AFS, i've tried the 85 with F800 (standard freeride) wing, and clocked around 45kph with it. A supercruiser would never go that fast.
Thanks WOH. I don't think this is something I have fully understood until now. I must admit that I have been a bit focused on surface area, thinking it was the key stat for lift. Kind of like in windsurfing we talk board volume not length.
From a riding perspective I seem to get irritated by the absolute stall speed more than anything else, and it seems like it takes quite a bit more sail to keep a lower area high aspect wing (i65) going through the lulls relative to a medium aspect medium area wing (i76). But that is pretty subjective.
Select to expand quotesteview said..
I have a foi x 145 and a super cruiser foil which I really enjoy. As wind gets stronger and to explore a different style of foiling I was wondering if the board would work with outboard straps and a higher aspect foil ( maybe afs w85 ) ? Any thoughts appreciated
I have the AFS Wind 95 with F800 wing on a Goya Bolt 135, have taken it up to 22 knots and it is great, but it is a more advanced level foil, and so very responsive but with rock solid feeling (F800 wing is solid carbon), I have the single bolt mast base nut 1/8" from the end/ rear of the mast track and it is perfectly ballanced, just light pressure from my big toe is all I need to adjust height.
Select to expand quoteWhiteofHeart said..
A small low aspect wing is just a low aspect wing for more wind, sure its a little faster, but you'll need a lot more power to get going, and the improvement in glide and speed isnt as big.
Remember, a high aspect wing gives about 1,5-2x times as much power / lift as a similarly sized low aspect wing. In the end, a 1100cm2 high aspect will give the same, if not more early lift than your supercruiser, with more speed and more glide through lulls. The downside being its more direct, and has a lower stall speed due to its smaller surface (although you're traveling at different speeds aswell, so always wondering, would you rather have a foil averaging at 25kph with 15kph stall speed, or a foil averaging 35kph with a 20kph stall speed? The second one has a wider range of use and allows for more loss of speed in the jibe). A low aspect wing is soft, you won't feel much if you get a gust or a chop, whereas a higher aspect wing has a little more direct / agressive power.
Also remember, if wings are similarly sized, the stall speed is similar, although the performance in terms of speed and lift doesn't at all have to be.
As for the AFS, i've tried the 85 with F800 (standard freeride) wing, and clocked around 45kph with it. A supercruiser would never go that fast.
Think I've decided to go down the AFS route and buy both the f700 and f800 wings . Can't however decide on mast length . Ax foil x 145 is only 190 long and 71 wide would the 85 suit it better ? What advantages/ disadvantages would there be in the 95 ? Cheers
Select to expand quotesteview said..WhiteofHeart said..
A small low aspect wing is just a low aspect wing for more wind, sure its a little faster, but you'll need a lot more power to get going, and the improvement in glide and speed isnt as big.
Remember, a high aspect wing gives about 1,5-2x times as much power / lift as a similarly sized low aspect wing. In the end, a 1100cm2 high aspect will give the same, if not more early lift than your supercruiser, with more speed and more glide through lulls. The downside being its more direct, and has a lower stall speed due to its smaller surface (although you're traveling at different speeds aswell, so always wondering, would you rather have a foil averaging at 25kph with 15kph stall speed, or a foil averaging 35kph with a 20kph stall speed? The second one has a wider range of use and allows for more loss of speed in the jibe). A low aspect wing is soft, you won't feel much if you get a gust or a chop, whereas a higher aspect wing has a little more direct / agressive power.
Also remember, if wings are similarly sized, the stall speed is similar, although the performance in terms of speed and lift doesn't at all have to be.
As for the AFS, i've tried the 85 with F800 (standard freeride) wing, and clocked around 45kph with it. A supercruiser would never go that fast.
Think I've decided to go down the AFS route and buy both the f700 and f800 wings . Can't however decide on mast length . Ax foil x 145 is only 190 long and 71 wide would the 85 suit it better ? What advantages/ disadvantages would there be in the 95 ? Cheers
95 is hollow so lighter, and taller is good if your foiling swells or have 2-3' waves to go over. Longer mast helps in going upwind too, but with a 71 wide board may not be a big issue.
