Hey crew,
I'm an intermediate foiler - not tied to any brand, not pushing any agenda - just genuinely curious about where the sport is heading. I get the feeling that a lot of foilers just follow what the local shop or "team rider" says is the best without questioning it too much. Meanwhile, you've got guys promoting gear they clearly don't understand, tossing around specs and buzzwords to sound legit. Just because they have been foiling for 2 years and have owned two different foils they think they are an expert....
From where I sit, it looks like surf foiling has lost a lot of momentum lately. A few reasons stand out to me:
Cost - Getting into it is expensive, and there's this idea you have to buy the most high-end gear to even start. That's a big barrier for guys who are used to buying a custom board each year for only $700-900
Learning curve - It's steep. I'm a decent surfer and it still took a while to click. For most people it's even harder.
Foil Drive - Personally, I think it's a great way to learn and stay away from crowded peaks. But I know some surfers see the motor, helmet, sunnies, and impact vest and just roll their eyes.
Perception - Let's be honest - to a lot of surfers, foilers (especially e-foilers) look like the rollerbladers of the sea.
So I'm throwing this out there to the Seabreeze crew:
What do people actually want out of foiling?
And what would help more people get into it and stick with it?
Is it cheaper, better-designed gear direct from a manufacturer?
Is it straight-up, honest advice - not shop BS or ego-driven promo talk?
Is it community groups or proper coaching that teaches safety, etiquette, and how to get going without blowing up every session?
Would love to hear people's take - from beginners to lifers. What's helping the sport grow, and what's holding it back?
From what I see:
Pros:
- Seeing other people do it and enjoying themselves
- Availability of cheap gear, new and 2nd hand.
- Inflatables are decent solutions, unlike for SUPing or surfing.
- WingFoiling helps extending your water time with your skill set
Cons:
- The injuries: most foils have become progressively razor sharp and I am horrified by the injuries I see now on mundane falls, something we only saw years ago when people where using kite foils.
- efoils in crowded lineups: they are acting as scarecrows for surfers, giving a bad image of the sport.
Select to expand quoteLordofthewings said..
Hey crew,
I'm an intermediate foiler - not tied to any brand, not pushing any agenda - just genuinely curious about where the sport is heading. I get the feeling that a lot of foilers just follow what the local shop or "team rider" says is the best without questioning it too much. Meanwhile, you've got guys promoting gear they clearly don't understand, tossing around specs and buzzwords to sound legit. Just because they have been foiling for 2 years and have owned two different foils they think they are an expert....
From where I sit, it looks like surf foiling has lost a lot of momentum lately. A few reasons stand out to me:
Cost - Getting into it is expensive, and there's this idea you have to buy the most high-end gear to even start. That's a big barrier for guys who are used to buying a custom board each year for only $700-900
Learning curve - It's steep. I'm a decent surfer and it still took a while to click. For most people it's even harder.
Foil Drive - Personally, I think it's a great way to learn and stay away from crowded peaks. But I know some surfers see the motor, helmet, sunnies, and impact vest and just roll their eyes.
Perception - Let's be honest - to a lot of surfers, foilers (especially e-foilers) look like the rollerbladers of the sea.
So I'm throwing this out there to the Seabreeze crew:
What do people actually want out of foiling?
And what would help more people get into it and stick with it?
Is it cheaper, better-designed gear direct from a manufacturer?
Is it straight-up, honest advice - not shop BS or ego-driven promo talk?
Is it community groups or proper coaching that teaches safety, etiquette, and how to get going without blowing up every session?
Would love to hear people's take - from beginners to lifers. What's helping the sport grow, and what's holding it back?
Why would you want more people to get into it? Most of us can just enjoy it for what it is unless we are trying to make money out of it as a first post like yours suggests to me you are.
I could just exclusively be a surfer again if i wanted to be part of an over patronized movement.
not sure you have identified a problem that actually exists. . From the crew who have been there from the start the growth has been nothing short of exponential.
Select to expand quotecolas said..
From what I see:
Pros:
- Seeing other people do it and enjoying themselves
- Availability of cheap gear, new and 2nd hand.
- Inflatables are decent solutions, unlike for SUPing or surfing.
- WingFoiling helps extending your water time with your skill set
Cons:
- The injuries: most foils have become progressively razor sharp and I am horrified by the injuries I see now on mundane falls, something we only saw years ago when people where using kite foils.
- efoils in crowded lineups: they are acting as scarecrows for surfers, giving a bad image of the sport.
Hey
just picking up on the injuries part. It put me off foiling for a while, I've been winging now for 3.5yrs without any real issues. I know one of my Glide foils is pretty sharp ( I do sand tips).
One local guy really rips on very old fat smooth edge foils which look like any impact wouldn't be so bad.
Do you think average joe ( which most of us are) would be better on older rounder edged foils to prevent injuries. New Fireballs and similar HA foils are like swords!
I have a seen a pretty decent decline in the surfing side of foiling.I do miss the influx of new riders with lots stoke and willingness to interact. I did think a lot more surfers would jump onto foiling.
Select to expand quotergmacca said..
Do you think average joe ( which most of us are) would be better on older rounder edged foils to prevent injuries.
Of course!
As long as you do a Donaldson on the trailing edge, you wont notice the difference.
Just saw this comment today for instance:
"after cutting my foot following a collision with the trailing edge of the foil, i rounded the edge with sandpaper and the result was that i noticed no loss of performance either in terms of vmax or cruising speed... so i'm wondering why not make the edges less sharp?"
Another, 4 days ago: nerve cut
How about some footage from racing and seeing the best compete? Currently we have the equivalent of the world championships of DW foiling on in Hawaii and not a live stream to be seen. More media may equal more interest particularly when people see strategy in line choices, speed charts and close finishes etc.
I'm the only regular that SurfFoils at my spot. A few locals from an hr away sometimes come up to play which is really cool. Most of the Wingers just don't want to play in the waves and just enjoy the flat water/wind aspect of foiling. The prone surfers are curious but it's just another thing to purchase and learn. Hard to do when there's so much good surf and limited time. We are looking at trialling a demo session with a boat for the curious and see if a few crossover.
In my area lack of good foil waves is why I don't prone anymore. Crowds make a super more appealing. Paddle lets me get on foil outside the crowd and have more space to myself.
wing is even better. So waiting for wind is my current go to.
my goal is uncrowded waves. Motors getting cheaper would help out a lot.
And Tuesday 8th, a cardiac arrest.A 26yo lifeguard that went foiling after his shift in the famous "Cotes des Basques", the historic French spot, beginner-friendly. Died in view of his friends.
www.sudouest.fr/pyrenees-atlantiques/biarritz/biarritz-un-surfeur-de-26-ans-decede-a-la-cote-des-basques-25176638.php
I've never understood the whole "grow the sport" mentality.Like...isn't it enough to just enjoy
your time on the water without having mobs of people? Ever try surf a crowded line-up now at any good surf spot? That's what u get when u "grow the sport".
Advance the sport through innovation and production, now thats more like it.
Select to expand quotemartyman said..
I've never understood the whole "grow the sport" mentality.Like...isn't it enough to just enjoy
your time on the water without having mobs of people? Ever try surf a crowded line-up now at any good surf spot? That's what u get when u "grow the sport".
Advance the sport through innovation and production, now thats more like it.
The grow the sport push a lot of the time comes from people with vested interests in the sport to grow the business model.
In my view foiling has plateaued. The same as SUPs. The same as wave skis.The same as long boards. The same as bodyboards. And yes, even short boards.
When a new concept comes out, everyone raves about it. When they first see it they have to try it. Then it becomes big in marketing & everyone is attracted to it until it ends up being a common concept. Just like seeing prone surfers catching waves. And there is a reason why there are more of them than any other.
Then comes cost, generations, convenience & image.
Most young families that go to the beach usually have bodyboards & foam boards for their kids. Easy to throw in a car and cheap to buy. The kids then learn how to surf. As the kids grow older they can progress to a surfboard. This in my view is the biggest population that hit the water every summer.
The surfboard is the cheapest & convenient watercraft that most of their friends can afford. From there it usually is a bigger step to be able change to another watercraft & be different to your young mates. The biggest thing is cost. The next is change of mind set & image & then there is convenience.
Again the surfboard & body board is convenient compared to Longboards, SUPs, Wave skis & foil boards. Just throw a body board & surfboard in your car & go surf. So quick & easy. And the mind set of surfing these are already instilled since at a very young age.
I too was not going to go to a SUP from my surfboard. My older mate tried to convince me. Even gave me a go at using one. I just couldn't balance & kept falling off. Never caught a wave with it. But surfing with him I saw the advantages and decided to get a SUP & never looked back. This progressed to SUP foiling and Winging. And still haven't looked back. I was so glad I made the change. I had more choices than ever before. More waves now than having to continually compete with other prone surfers for a wave count of maybe 5 waves in a 1 to 2 hour session.
So back to foiling. Yes the foils & foil board designs are progressing & so is the cost. They are more of a common site & now not so much of a surprising, interesting sight on the water anymore. So the appeal is less.
When foiling started I had a small wave location mainly for myself. When foiling got more popular & shifted to prone foiling also, then I had more & more foiling company to compete for waves. This was OK to the point of foils getting more advanced to glide & pump for the proners to pump back out & steal more of the waves that I would paddle for. Even worse with efoilers. But luckily for me this small wave location became quite boring & I was already by then foiling the head high & over head waves much futher out than what these pump & glide big foils could handle. Obviously now some of them have adjusted to take on these waves as well. Just catching & pumping up on the swell away from the actual break. Which my older Neilpryde foil & heavy foil SUP cannot do. I had to catch the break right on the shoulder of the wave as any normal SUP or prone surfer would do before getting up on foil. But for me the older slower more blunt foil is fun & more challenging in the surf. Not much different to normal surfing if I want. I've had it leaning right over with my hand, not paddle skimming the water without a breach. I've also had the foil bang my shins & back of head often without being cut open. So wouldn't bother going to these newer design sharp edge pointy wings anyway.
I really think a lot of the time it can be muscle laziness that makes one go to easier, lighter boards & foils. We now have foils that wont breach when the wingtips protrudes above the water surface. Foils that are much faster & glide further. None of these are needed for me when I just want to surf. You can learn with older gear and push it to its limits.
Don't get me wrong. I've got newer foils as well. But they are for Winging where I need the faster speeds & glides on flat water and also the more surfing foil, but faster & more forgiving when I start getting onto waves with a wing.
Sorry for the ramble on. But that's how I see it.??
Have to agree. Using old foil for waves and a newer different brand foil for wing foiling . Perfect
