catalyst or noise cant decide

mate, you need to demo the noise, by the sound of it - your only info regarding the noise kite is the forum feedback reviews, not knocking bws noise kites but.... its being marketed similar to what best did to get a foot in the door so to speak - why because it works, don't let the froth of forum reviews dictate a decision.. you have to try any kite before you dish out the dosh otherwise as a common saying goes in stock markets. your buying the rumor and may well end up selling the fact......

i haven't tried either kites... but i did demo a new slingshot kite model and thought it wasn't all that great.. others froth on about it , just shows its each to their own you got to find your own.. since you been kiting for as long as you have id say you know what your looking for... so - demo ,demo, demo!!!!!

yes you guys are right it looks like i will have to track ryland down for a demo in a few weeks at scarbs when im back from work

Hi Jiggler,

I have flown both the 8m Catalyst and the 8m Noise back to back in the same conditions so reckon I can offer my observations and thoughts. There has been a LOT of hype about the Noise and I want to offer my observations as objectively as possible.

Firstly, both kites are very good in the waves, although both kites are very different and attack the same problem from different approaches.

Test Conditions: This is important as the conditions would expose weaknesses in either kite readily. Directly onshore wind, offshore reef with shoulder to just over head high waves. Wind was a gusty 15-20 knots and a bit of current as the waves washed over the reef. Difficult wave riding conditions!

Power: I thought the Noise 8m had slightly, and only slightly, more power than the Catalyst 8m. There was no astounding difference in my opinion, just a slight amount more than the Catalyst. I'd say more than 5%, but less than 10% more.

Upwind: I thought both kites had good upwind capability and I couldn't honestly pick an advantage being on either kite, so I'm calling this one a draw.

Drifting: Again, both kites performed very well in this area. Both kites drifted back without luffing or any sign of stalling. Another draw in my opinion.

Responsiveness to turn input: This is where the kites started to differ. The Noise 8m, being flown on the 45cm bar was much less responsive than the Catalyst which flies on the 50cm bar. The Noise uses a pulley bridle whereas the Catalyst is a fixed pulley less bridle. The Noise has a feel more like a pulleyed bridle kite - detached. The Catalyst will respond quickly and directly to all bar input as there are no pulleys to dull the steering inputs on the back lines - Direct and more 5-line feel to the steering from the Catalyst.

The Noise is unresponsive to smaller, more subtle inputs, you need to crank it to turn it, whereas the Catalyst does respond to all bar inputs. Winner? Neither. It would depend on your riding style as both are attributes which could be desired by different riders depending on their approach to riding waves.

Turning speed and style: The 8m Noise turns a wide arc for moderate steering inputs. The kite creates power through the turn due to the wide radius of the turn and the forward air speed. The Noise 8m will turn hard but only if you crank the bar hard to full extent, at which point it will turn tighter and eventually pivot on itself requiring an easing of the bar pressure and sheeting. I think the 8m Bar is too small for the size of the kite. The 6m Noise uses the same bar and turns faster as everyone has indicated in other reviews. Maybe this indicates a more appropriately sized bar for the 6m if you want to throw the kite around a bit.

The Catalyst turns tight and wingtip pivots at full bar throw in a turn. The Turn is faster and tighter on the Catalyst and in a normal turn, depowers more than the Noise due to it's tighter arc with less airspeed over the canopy from the tight arc. A smaller bar on the Catalyst would produce the same results as the Noise in terms of power in the wider arc turns, or just turn a little less aggressively.

Response to gusts: The Noise, being a 5 strut, heavier kite tends to sit and not move too quickly when wind gusts increase or decrease, and the pull remains quite consistent. The Catalyst being a much lighter kite tends to adjust itself in relation to neutral within the wind window quite quickly both forwards and back and in gusty winds may produce mild on and off power as the kite quickly settles back and forth in the gusts. As it responds so quickly, there is little problem with this.

The Bar: The finish on the Ozone bar is slightly brighter IMO and is equally clean and free of "stuff" with the exception of the above the bar trim system which works superbly, easily adjusted one handed and doesn't slip. Hard bar ends can hurt the nose of your board in a bad stack is one negetive. Has below the bar centre line untwisting which can only be engaged when riding the leash clipped to the suicide ring. Below the bar flagging can be chosen but at the expense of the rotating centre line thingy.

The Noise bar is free of "stuff" and has a nice feel to it, sheeting is easy and both bars had similar bar pressure (Light to low end of medium for the Catalyst and just low end of medium for the Noise). I didn't like the below the bar trim on the Noise Bar at all. I found the cleat sharp on my hands and found the trim impossible to use one handed. It takes both hands letting go of the bar and one hand taking slack though the cleat and one hand pulling the trim rope towards the cleat on the chicken loop to make it move. Once cleated it didn't move either, found it a little tricky to uncleat but that may be just a case of me getting used to it. Below the bar safety and spinning front lines is good. No below the bar trim system is easy to use in my experience, they all require two hands.

Relaunching: I found the Noise didn't fall and rest on it's wingtip like the Catalyst, instead the leading edge leaned forward of the lower wingtip, back winded the outside wingtip foil and plonked itself down leading edge first onto the water and facing the wind. I pulled the back line and the kite swung around, rolled onto it's back, and then the wingtip caught some breeze and it unfurled back onto it's wingtip and allowed me to pull it back out of the water. It wasn't a definitive test as I only tested it once but it was less happy on it's wingtip than the Catalyst. Again, this is a bit inconclusive and would have to be compared in a 10 crash test, back to back to really get a true feel. It was just my experience. I didn't rig the kite, Ryland did, so I am assuming the kite was optimally rigged.

Unhooked: Both kites performed very well unhooked so long as the kites were correctly trimmed. I was able to seriously backstall the Noise 8m when unhooked and looping downwind in onshore waves which resulted in a centre axis pivot and ended up flying backwards towards the water,deep in the wind window which I quickly corrected by grabbing the chickenloop and letting go of the bar. In the situation where this occurred, I believe any kite could possibly have done the same thing and would have needed the chickenloop grabbing to save the stall. A one off anomoly or something else? Don't know so wouldn't consider this experience conclusive either.

Summary: I really enjoyed the comparison of riding both kites and I liked both kites a lot. I would like to ride the Noise again in a down the line wave riding scenario to get a different feel. I felt in the conditions, the more agile and responsive Catalyst was easier to throw around which was necessary in the onshore conditions and made for a better session for me. However, the Noise had a good feel and was designed to be more of a "park and ride" kite in down the line side shore conditions rather than the direct onshore wave riding which we were doing, so I want to ride the Noise again in more appropriate conditions so I can further exploit it's drifting and steadiness.

I don't think the side shore conditions will change anything I have written in terms of characteristics of the kites as they wont be changed, but how my style would change to fit the kites in the more suitable conditions would be much more of interest to see if I truly can park and forget the kite and unhook to hack and bash my way down the line.

Great stuff and I strongly suggest anyone interested, should definately demo the kites you are keen on to see whether the attributes of the kites dovetail with your style, or do you want to radically change your style to suit the kite?

Thanks to Ry for the loan of the 8m Noise.

DM

Yeah, nice work DM.....would be nice to see a similar comparison done with the Cat and the North Fuse.