This comes from Cottesloe councillor SALLY PYVIS, concerning the proposal to change the Local Laws so that launching, landing and windsurfing will be prevented at Telephone Box, near Deane Street, but allowed from about 80m south to the Dutch Inn Groyne in a new official area for kiters and windsurfers.
All,
I urge you, and your kitesurfing and windsurfing associates, to make submissions on the AMENDMENT TO BEACHES AND BEACH RESERVE LOCAL LAW 2012 - RESTRICTIONS ON THE USE OF WATERCRAFT.
I have made a list of points (below) which may clarify the process and assist you in making your submission.
1 It is important you and your associates make INDIVIDUAL SUBMISSIONS as this will, in my understanding, carry more weight (ie numbers count).
2. Written SUBMISSIONS CLOSE 4:00pm 7 March 2016, and should be emailed to council@cottesloe.wa.gov.au. Once submissions have been processed by TOC staff, I am guessing the issue (including the OFFICER RECOMMENDATION) will go to either the March or April round of Council Briefings and Full Council Meetings (see dates below) ...
Council Briefing Session 6:00 pm Tuesday 22 March 2016
Full Council Meeting 7:00 pm Monday 29 March 2016
Council Briefing Session 6:00 pm Tuesday April 2016
Full Council Meeting 7:00 pm Monday 26 April 2016
3. I suggest you also COPY YOUR SUBMISSION to Mayor Jo Dawkins mayor@cottesloe.wa.gov.au and ALL councilors at #councillors@cottesloe.wa.gov.au - (don't forget the preceding hash) - to ensure your voice is heard.
4. Link to TOC website outlining proposed changes is .... http://www.cottesloe.wa.gov.au/d/Resource_Library/Council/Public_Notices/1MG2I1C4WLJZUJ8QA6L2XM2WDN3GQ4/8NUOO6SL45PHM21.pdf/Public+Notice+-+Proposed+Amendment+to+the+Beaches+and+Beach+Reserves+Local+Law.pdf?
5. In a nutshell, my understanding of the proposed changes (refer map below) is ...
- The currently permitted KITESURFING & WINDSURFING area north of North Cottesloe SLSC will be deleted altogether.
- The ONLY area for KITESURFERS to SET UP and LAUNCH will be between Rosendo St and Princes St.
- The ONLY area for WINDSURFERS to SET UP and LAUNCH will be between Princes St and South Cottesloe Groyne (aka Dutch Inn or Beach St).
6. Both KITESURFERS and WINDSURFERS will continue to sail freely offshore wherever they please but will be restricted to setup, launching and landing in separate designated zones.
- An additional shower and tap will be installed west of Salvado St (as current tap and shower facilities at "Phonebox" will be out of both zones)
- The children's slide at Dutch Inn playground will be moved north (consolidated with the swings at the north end) and fenced in (for safety) to create more open grass space (at the south end) for windsurfers to use ... the idea being to reduce potential conflict between playground users and windsurfers.
PLEASE BE REMINDED, these are PROPOSED AMENDMENTS and careful consideration will be given to public feedback received as part of the submission process.
One of my reservations about the process of public consultation is that the majority of affected "users" (in this case kite surfers and windsurfers) are NOT Cottesloe residents and ratepayers and there is a risk their opinions may not be heard. I therefore urge you to forward this email to other interested sportspersons and sporting organisations in order to alert them to this important issue.
Many thanks,
Sally.
Thanks for the post Alverstone.
As a Cottesloe kiter [and a voter and rate payer] I have a few issues with this proposal.
In winter the only stretch of sand that is wide enough to launch a kite is at 'Phone box' [Deme St] as the rest of the beach is eroded back to the foredunes. Far from being dangerous this is the safest option in winter when otherwise you would be launching or landing in the dunes
It might be reasonable to impose a restriction on Kitesurfing at Phonebox in summer, but the place is inavariably deserted on windy Winter days [and in summer too if > 20knots of wind] and no conflict would arise. I am writing to the council to suggets that they impose a seasonal restriction only.
Secondly there is no need to impose restrictions on launching a South Cottesloe beach, again is it a relatively lightly used beach, where no conflict occurs with other users, and has a wide width of sand in summer and is popular with kiters . In winter it has breaking waves on the reefs at Deep Six and the atrificial reef. Again if restrictions must be imposed they should be seasonal. There is already a ban on kitesurfing at Cottesloe Main and that really should suffice.
Thirdly the currently permitted KITESURFING & WINDSURFING area north of North Cottesloe SLSC will be deleted as wellcompletely without any justification in terms of conflict with other users.
The most dangerous thing on that stertch of beach is flying golf balls . I kid you not, I have had the swish past my head on a number of occasions. Maybe they should ban that too!
If everyone is forced to kite in one tight area it only exacerbates the dangers for everyone.
Cottesloe council is one of the most 'anti everything' councils in the state. They have banned everything to the point that it is the most boring beach to visit in Perth and they want to ban yet another thing. They should be honest and admit that they really just want to ban FUN. Yeah lets do that and remove anyone with a smile on there face from the suburb so it can be reserved for the sour faced property developers who dont even go to the beach in case the get sand inside their Porsche Cayennes
i am amazed how a golf club like seaview can continue to be where it is without Huge fences to stop a wayward ball . Somehow i have NFI how more cars aren't damaged and people hit . I remember playing penants there in winter and some of the holes aiming out over the beach to allow the sw'er to bring it back
As a kiter who occasionally does a downwinder through Cott, I'm not really clear on the best landing or launching spots but definitely would like to put a submission into council, as I feel that we should all look out for each others beaches.
Perhaps we can get a consensus on what would be the best/safest areas so that individually we can make submissions. Niall has outlined his thoughts above, do the majority of Cott kiters agree?
Good topic, It is important to do something now before too late. Reminiscent of the early Kite years at Cott.....
Like Niall I too am a Cott resident/rate payer and have been kiting with Niall here since the late 90s and before that as a ‘Poler’.
We as a State love our rules, and as usual the council has reacted with stick rather than carrot.
As Niall suggests let’s look at why the areas we use were chosen in the first place
firstly amenity:
safe off road parking,
grassed area for rigging,
good beach access,
shower facilities.
Secondly safety:
wide beach,
no trees,
good visibility,
good water access,
no shore break,
no reef to trample (or be trampled by)
no groynes.
So back to the carrot; rather than ban water sport, how about attract it to another area using the above criteria, why not provide:
off road parking
rigging area
showers away from beach access points
wider, straight paths without kite/sail snagging wire and posts.
Warning signs to the public regarding risks etc
I pay enough rates, selfish though it is, It would be nice to get something I enjoy out of them. Plus I hear there is a Coastcare grant available from the State Government to assist with infrastructure.
Cott Council needs to face it, Kiting is not going away it will only grow; WA is a World renown centre for Kiting. Surely the tourism $$$ Opportunity is huge?
Over the last 15-20 years we have shown ourselves to be a responsible lot with good self regulation and are happy to be involved in future planning.
So come on Cott council break out the carrots and lets talk.
Niall I disagree
You say Cott is banning things - I think they are pretty damn accommodating. Two other councils have jumped in and banned things very quickly in the last few years, Cott is being very consultative and pretty much leaving us with the two main areas for kiting and windsurfing (BTW who actually uses the beach north of the SLSC for kiting or windsurfing? Never seen anyone, they are all well south down at Dutch Inn.)
Golf balls north of the SLSC? People are hitting golf balls over 1000m from the seaview course to NORTH of the SLSC? ??? 
I can't see that ..... so I gather u mean they are practicing on the beach? If so that would surely be no good under current bylaws and you could complain to the council
So lets look at the facts...
The area for kiters has always been north of the windsurfers, and only for WAKSA / AKSA members. The kite area is well south of the "main" Cott beach. Those rules were flouted all the time, with kiters going into windsurf area, non members there and if anyone called them on it they got abused and all the usual carry-on.
Bugger-all people kite or sail north of the Cott SLSC.
It is crap in winter in he designated area bewteen the two groynes, but your "no beach" argument is dumb as everyone will go to Woodies or river in a westerly. But yes I do agree that a seasonal approach is more sensible just in case kiters do want to use it.
Windsurfers have used the southern end with the grassed area for 30yrs plus, and about 15 (?) years ago some rocket scientist put a playground there - 20m downwind of the rigging area. Duh. Now there has been one incident of a sail flipping over and hitting somebody the Council has to be seen to do something to have a legally defensible position. Windsurfers have said 'well geez, move the damn playground then' and the Council seem to agree.
Any restriction on us is minimal - better than a total ban like every other council has run with!!!
I reiterate - the area for kiters and the fact one needed to be an association member to kite there was disregarded by so many for so long - and when windsurfers brought it up here in a nice way we were abused. Often. Your assertion that no conflict occurs is laughable - in one summer I saw at least a few examples of walkers almost hit by kite lines as show-offs tuned 1m from the waters edge. This minor restriction is an unbelieveaby good result for you lot, given kiters' totally belligerent attitude to use of that area for many years.
Mark I agree i also think the council are at least trying to work with kiters and windsurfers and also keep parent's whose children use the playground where some water users (windsurfers, paddlers etc.) rig up happy by consolidating the playground and fencing it off.
1 Carrot................the council are proposing putting in a shower at the southern end.
2 Carrots..............there is already off street parking at the southern end.
3 Carrots..............the grassed area at the southern end is a lot bigger than at phone box the grass just isn't as green and has prickles :(
As for the phonebox area being seasonal; maybe but remember that if things go wrong there it is only a short distance to the road and you dont have the dunes as a buffer.
btw I am also a local and use the area for paddling, kiting and swimming.
Mark i kite at Princes St and we have more windsufers sailing in our area these days than kiters sailing up by the beach street groyne, especially in a southerly. It doesn't seem to be a drama so long as we keep out of each others way. I have also seen a few windsurfers doing speed runs off phonebox which given the number of kiters using that area now could be dangerous. But then so does boosting on a 17-19m Edge in a 20 knot breeze close to the beach. 
If i do make a written submission i will be raising the point that consolidating water users into a smaller area has the potential for safety issues and i believe the council should leave the area as it is for water users. Put in a shower at the southern end, consolidate and fence off the playground, fertilize and water the lawn and put in a few more bins.
I was down at Dutchies for a paddle yesterday morning and realised i actually kite at Salvado St not Princes St that's the windsurfing area opppps My Bad.
Thank you Mark Australia you have made several good point in his post. Unfortunately you couldn't resist your all too familiar vitriol towards kiters in 'your windsurfing area', which somewhat mars the good points that you are trying to make. I would rather this important post on the question of Cottesloe beach access, didn't descend into one of your all too familiar kiters v windsurfer diatribes.
I made the flying golf ball thing simply as an example of how sports in Cottesloe can occasionally present hazards. It demonstrates that a certain level of hazard is presumably acceptable, otherwise the council would ban all activities which could result in injury. People have been hit on the bike path and car parks in the cove area, and i have certainly had balls whizz past my ear and my car got hit once. Perhaps the absurd suggested ban on making sandcastles at Cott main, because of the tripping hazard was a better example. Yes that too was seriously discussed at council.
Mark make the valid point that windsurfers [and i am one of them] were using the dutch inn area long before the council built a playground in it 15 years ago. Not such a dumb idea when you consider it has been there 15 years, and it is only now that someone's child has been hit by a windblown rig. You could see that as a proof of the safety of cohabitation, rather than as a black mark. A blown windsurfing rig would be unlikely to seriously injure someone, not so a child running out in front of a car or cyclist, and no barrier exist around the playground despite its proximity to busy road. In any case the council plans to move the playground North which is sensible.
What is not sensible is to restrict windsurfers and kiters access to other beaches in the area when there has been no demonstration of hazard or conflict. For example in Northerlies a lot of windsurfers choose to land and launch on south cott beach and sail on the reefs between Dutch Inn and Artificial reef, which are at times better formed and ridable than the waves at Dutchies. This will now be banned. A small group of windsurfers has always rigged North of North Cott SLSC on the grass. Again that arrangement has never upset anyone, yet it too will be banned. Some Kitesurfers traditionally have launched down winders from just south of North st.....again BANNED.
Why do we need these bans. The number of day those spots are useful in any year may be few, but when the conditions are right they can be very useful and on those days typically windsurfers are the only ones on the beach. It may not be Mark Australia who is using those areas but it is infringing on someone's access. If we all took the attitude that if it doesn't directly affect we shouldn't care he world would be a poorer place.
Why the designated areas for poleys and teabaggers is it that crowded there.we kite amongst windsurfers all the time and never have a problem set up in the same area have a chat about the weather,work and woman pretty cruisey seems WA has a lot of **** going down and now councils are implementing bans and restrictions.what is it ?crowds,complaints between parties sounds like you need to party??
How do they enforce the ban without knowing a number plate? Are the cops going to come down and lock me up? What a great use of resources, maybe some cash should be diverted instead to stopping every car at the beach getting broken into once a month or keeping these pricks in jail a little longer.
The Council isn't implementing a ban they are asking for written submissions to be considered at the March council meeting.
Some of you need to get off your soapboxes and be more pro-active rather than reactionary
As a group (Water Users, both Kiters and Windsurfers) with a vested interest in the outcome of the councils decision rather than squabble and sit back.
I think we should make a concerted effort to convince the council that the Entire area of Dutch Inn and Dog beach north of the Deep 6 reef through to Leighton beach be open for our recreational use.
I think we as a collective of water users need to agree on key points to include in individual written submissions to council and if need be we start an online petition.
Hopefully enough of you will agree.
I say let the kids and families enjoy the park without the fear of getting taken out by a windsurfers lazy unsecured rig again, which is what caused all this debacle.
Dont really understand why you all crowd in on the busiest public beaches? Could maybe understand it if there was good peeling cross/off waves but wtf , sloppy messy crap????
Its a MASSIVE coastline with MILES of near empty beach, why battle for a little tiny patch in the middle of the kids, families, surf clubs etc ?
Is it just so you have a patch of mowed grass and a shower that attracts you to the crowded spot, or the need to be seen by the general public to make you feel cool ??
Why not just move right away from the poor kiddies and their playground you big bullies. 
Why not just set up down the beach ? Save your tax dollars thousands in moving a playground just cause of being lazy to walk a bit or fear of sand on your sail, it wont kill you lol. 
Select to expand quotelotofwind said..
I say let the kids and families enjoy the park without the fear of getting taken out by a windsurfers lazy unsecured rig again, which is what caused all this debacle.
Dont really understand why you all crowd in on the busiest public beaches? Could maybe understand it if there was good peeling cross/off waves but wtf , sloppy messy crap????
Its a MASSIVE coastline with MILES of near empty beach, why battle for a little tiny patch in the middle of the kids, families, surf clubs etc ?
Is it just so you have a patch of mowed grass and a shower that attracts you to the crowded spot, or the need to be seen by the general public to make you feel cool ??
Why not just move right away from the poor kiddies and their playground you big bullies.
Why not just set up down the beach ? Save your tax dollars thousands in moving a playground just cause of being lazy to walk a bit or fear of sand on your sail, it wont kill you lol.
Go back to the NSW Forum..............Laurie imho the general section should be renamed..................General-WA
^^^^oooooo, one is a bit pretentious, isn't one lol. There is a WA section you can post in if you dont wont GENERAL section people involved. Complaining of one rigging spot that the grass isnt as green as the other, and it has prickles, and think the council should come and water it for you ????? I guess you were joking........I hope lol.
Was actually serious, why not move away from the kiddies so they are not in danger of your unsecured gear ??
Why are you guys crowding in on one small tiny patch ?
Ban it there I say if its gunna save some kid getting smashed again.
Yeah buddy...........i would never offer an opinion on East Coast dramas even though i lived there for 6 years.
This is a local issue and probably should be in the WA section where i posted a link to the council's proposal, a lot of posters don't read their own state sub-forums and someone else posted in General-WA, so there you go.
Select to expand quoteWeta said..
Yeah buddy...........i would never offer an opinion on East Coast dramas even though i lived there for 6 years.
Well you probly should, most of us take an interest on these things as Australia is all the same place no matter what state you live in. The kid getting smashed over there can be used by councils over here as a " look what happened in WA" example.
Its already a no go zone on most big city main swimming beaches,,,, as it well should be.
Move away from kiddies play areas and busy city public beaches and you wont have a problem and not drag all the other responsable wind junkies, that already avoid these areas, down the drain with yáll.
Select to expand quotelotofwind said..
Its a MASSIVE coastline with MILES of near empty beach, why battle for a little tiny patch in the middle of the kids, families, surf clubs etc ?
Is it just so you have a patch of mowed grass and a shower that attracts you to the crowded spot, or the need to be seen by the general public to make you feel cool ??
If you go onto Google Earth and key in "Dutch Inn, Cottesloe" ....
you will soon discover that this sailing spot is located exactly in the centre of the Universe.
Chill, everyone! Chill!!!
This PROPOSED change to the local laws comes about because of a history of reported, anecdotal and witnessed near-misses, crashes, wayward kites, and Marc Sprod's tragic death, in and around Telephone Box (TB).
How many other locations, apart from St Kilda and that place in Botany Bay, Pelican Pt and Ardross in Perth, are so close to the public around the country?
TB is right in the public eye because they walk, run, pram, totter and drive past barely lines' lengths away (Look at the photo). If it was Woody's, Leighton or Mullas it would not be the issue because the public is 100s of metres away, and wouldn't see or experience any of the issues being discussed here. Move to the official zone and the dunes keep most of the public away form the 'danger' zone.
No-one could say Telephone was the safest of spots - it is a tight little corner that can also be used by families, swimmers and the neighbours, especially when is 12-18 knots, and even more so in the "peak"exposure period of the Xmas/NY break when Cottesloe residents are out in force, when not at Bunker Bay/Florence.
If you want to kite TB's breaks, just launch 100m south in the official zone, a couple of shy tacks, and Bob's Your Uncle.
Please use your energy to the opportunity to lobby for some of the points mentioned here; alternative parking, showers, better paths, signs, and the council consideration the lesser dangers posed to the public by the windsurfers (They need 22kts just to fart, so the public are gone )
Make a submission.
Thanks Alverstone,
I have emailed the Cottesloe council expressing my interest in seeing both Dutchies and the area north of NCSLSC as areas where kitesurfing is permitted. Cheers for providing such clear instructions on what's going on how we can interact with council to express our interests.
Me too.....the following.
1.Kitesurfing requires a certain amount of space to launch and land kites effectively and if anyone is suggesting restricting areas to them one must carefully consider how much space is available both in summer when the beaches are larger and winter when they are reduced somewhat. The safest area during both seasons is between Rosendo and Pearl street.
2.If any designated kite zones are considered then it is very important, actually CRITICAL to consider that up to 350 meters downwind is a potential danger zone and family/ swimming areas should be discouraged in this area. Uncontrolled or released kites can have the potential to be lethal.
3.Kites/Windsurfers rarely work in winds less than 14 knots. Beach access perhaps should be restricted to sports people only when the wind reaches 14 knots+.
4.The area between South Groyne and the north Groyne are very popular with all water sports activities and this whole area should be reserved exclusively for this. As there is a hidden reef this area is not suitable to swimmers, whereas on the other sides of both groynes they are both suitable and safe.
Select to expand quoteniall barrett said..
Thank you Mark Australia you have made several good point in his post. Unfortunately you couldn't resist your all too familiar vitriol towards kiters in 'your windsurfing area', which somewhat mars the good points that you are trying to make. I would rather this important post on the question of Cottesloe beach access, didn't descend into one of your all too familiar kiters v windsurfer diatribes.
Thankyou Niall and it is nice of you to say I made good points.
However this is not kiter vs windsurfer..... and I am not trying to make it so..... but the lack of adherence to rules by kiters in that area would surely be taken on board by Council. And it was some kiters who brought it up years ago too, not just me. So it is relevant and your mob need to counter it in submissions.
So I feel that the proposal is the best we can hope for as other councils (with possibly even less issues) have jumped straight into a ban. We all retain the areas, the playground is taken away and somebody scores a new shower.
We lose north of the SLSC which is crap anyway. If you want to kite Dutchies to the Artificial reef it is what, 500m downwind from your authorised launch area?
Not bad I reckon.
Mark, are you on drugs! Do you really think I need to be a member of an association before I can kite in a public open space! Are you for real?
^^^ I am not suggesting that is what should be done (assoc only areas) but both WAKSA and AKSA agreed to that. Take it up with them. Infighting and non-adherence to an agreed set of rules doesn't help when bans are suggested.....
Belligerence when people come to politely talk about conflict between different groups didn't either. The abuse we got for nicely saying 'hey FYI..." was so uncalled for we gave up.
Select to expand quoteAndy T said..
Mark, are you on drugs! Do you really think I need to be a member of an association before I can kite in a public open space! Are you for real?
Andy and others..................There has always been agreement in place between the Town of Cottesloe, WAKSA & WWA about this location. The council are now looking to make it a by-law (official) to protect the rights of all users of the area. Please see below.
WAKSA Location Guide for Dutch Inn Cottesloe, WA
1. Not suitable for beginners due to super shallow reef. Intermediate and expert kiters will have a blast all year round. Please obey ALL RULES to ensure access is maintained.
2. There are some strict rules that have been imposed by the local council which all riders must abide by.
3. Under no circumstances are kiters allowed to kite at Cottesloe beach (in front of the surf club) – DO NOT kite inside/north of the Cottesloe groyne.
4. Do not setup or kite north of Rosendo St
5. Do not setup on the grass at the phone box, car park or play area (see signs). * Stay clear and give way to all swimmers & other water users,including all
windsurfers at Dutch Inn.
6. Only WAKSA/AKSA members are allowed to kite at this location. AKSA membership tags must be worn on harnesses at all times for easy i.d. by rangers.
Failure to do so may result in a fine and confiscation of equipment.
^^^ correct me if I'm wrong but to add context to the Waksa/Aksa thing.. Wasn't the "agreement" negotiated many years ago as an ultimatum when access at Cottesloe as a whole was On the verge of being banned?
I'm guess the positive now is that they are accepting of kiting in Cott as opposed to 8 years ago, Albiet by locking in areas.
