C-Kites vs. Bow/SLE kites??

There are plenty of kites that offer fully depowered safeties without the need for a separate 5th line. Rev, Furia, IDS (not sure how well the IDS works in heavy wind though, can't speak from experience)

Ultimately, people can bitch about not being able to re-rig a kite when it goes onto one of the rear lines, but the safety is there to ditch the kite in extreme circumstances, its not a handlepass leash. I.e. tangles with death loops, heavy squalls that can't be managed on the standard safety etc. ]

To extend that, we see so many beginners hauling in the bar as though their life depended on it. Lots of stalled kites. Lots of kites flying backwards. Lots of guys sinking into the water as their kite stalls at the edge of the window. Lots of guys getting hauled off downwind with the bar pulled in.

The solution to the vast majority of kiting problems is to push out the bar.

I guess in order people should be taught to:

1. push out the bar
2. let go of the bar completely
3. release the kite to the primary safety system
4. release the kite to the total kill system.

Stopper balls should be removed or moved out as far as possible.

Thank you all for an insightful discussion. I am a relative beginner in kiteboarding trying to figure out whether I should buy BOW/SLE or C. I now own C-kites. As a result from this discussion I will save up to buy a 2008 bow kite. I have one question. What is the "death spiral" associated with BOW/SLE kite bridle braking and should I take this seriously? Are there bow kites that do not "death spiral" and how can I recognize them?

Thx.

Ive been using SLE kites for 3 years now, and have never had the line wrap round the tip. I havn't had a bridle snap, but a line is just as likely to snap on any style of kite.

Yep - but newbs don't always trawl through the older posts (which don't seem to be archived for as long anymore) so move on to the next thread old bean.

At least no-one has posted Eric for a while! No that is not a bl00dy liscence to do it either!!

Well chopper you are doing the same thing, how long since you used a late model bow/hybrid in strong winds and actually self landed it???
Or how many have you actually self landed in strong winds, which ones?
I'm just curious as to how you formulated this generalised law of how kites behave in strong winds?



Well I self landed a vapor3 yesterday on a fifth, was well behaved.
A few days ago I self landed a Core Combat GT 10.5 in 20+ knots using its dual front line system, no problem, had to walk up one front line in that case, had that line hooked around my harness hook until it flipped over
A few days earlier I self landed a CB IDS 13M in 18-20 knots, it flipped over into the LE down position (if it didn't I land it like the Core)
A few weeks ago I self landed an 11M Waroo 09 in 22-24 knots, I parked it on the beach and flagged to an upper front line, it dropped onto it LE as I walked upwind of it.
Recently I self landed a 2009 Ozone Light XC 14M in approx 16-18 knots, same method as the Waroo, or if it does not immediately sit down LE down and into the wind I move upwind os its in the centre of the window and I start down the flagging line with the flagging line wrapped once around my harness hook.

I can reload and have reloaded the Ozone, the SB/CB IDS, Core safety systems in the water (deep) and relaunched.
I have no doubt I could reload the Vapor3 system, just have not tested that aspect of the kite yet.
I would not be keen to try to reload the current Best c-loop in the water in winds strong enough to make the kite restless, however if the kite was sitting down well, and I was a long way offshore I would give it a go.
I've also reloaded and relaunched the Slingshot 09 bar system, in the water in decent winds.

You are exaggerating the safety of the traditional 5th line, lots can go wrong with them too, if they are not maintained and the user is unfamiliar.




Because a bow/hybrid flat kite has a higher projected area, you should know that!




No they probaly got sold the kite online or by another kiter who did not care about their safety or if they knew what they were buying, I see it every week over summer!

Who gives a toss what the so called top PKRA riders use, they all get their gear for free, and are probably all paid to ride, derrr!
The thing is that some of them are on bows, some are on bow derivatives and some are on hybrids, some are on modern 4 and 5 line C's too (which are way better than old 2002-2006C's!!!)




Nonsense, a Fuel or Hadlow Pro does not have the same depower/wind range as say a CB IDS or Slingy Rev2. However they are all very nice kites!
.



Well you have convinced yourself, but maybe go easy on spreading BS about the benefits of other kites safety systems.

Cya and

Goodwinds

Steve